Hamed barely made weight (his own fault, granted), which is obviously going to have had an effect on him. I think a rematch would have been more than justified. And I don't see how you can say a fighter who held the WBO, WBC and IBF belts isn't an elite fighter.
Yeah, he was more than a boxer! His personality played the biggest part in becoming probably the biggest icon the boxing world has ever seen. Personally speaking, I love Ali, although he did some nasty things and this is something that we shouldn't put aside (for example what he put Frazier and his family through, although Frazier supported him morally when Ali was strippped of his title). Even I know that, I still can't bring myself to hate or even dislike that guy. His poems, his jokes, provocations, the way he danced around the ring.. LEGEND!! Here is one of my favourite videos [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qC1nmVjtpo"]Muhammad Ali dancing HD - YouTube[/ame]
Nas was undeniably world class. Whilst any boxers record has a lot of padding, Hamed fought and beat legit world class opponents - to say otherwise shows either a complete lack of knowledge or else a blatant refusal to accept facts Ricky too dispatched a lot of top tier fighters, and the fact he lost to the two P4P kings does not diminish those he did beat - and beat convincingly let's not forget A lot depends on the use of the word "elite" - if you are using that as a measure of GOAT, then I concur neither Ricky nor Nas should be on the list. If you use it correctly to refer to their position within the boxing world at the time they were active then you cannot really make a case against them - multiple defenses, some solid opposition and a really decent set of skills
One swallow also does not make a summer - one loss (and at the END) does not make someone overrated. RJJ devastated, dominated and demoralized everyone he fought until the fight he lost - then everyone was saying "oh look overrated, blah, blah, blah..." ad nauseam. They did the same with Fedor, now with Silva...it's typical "fair weather fan" attitude that to be honest suprises me coming from you. Whilst I know you cannot box per se, you do have a solid knowledge of the game in terms of fighters and fights - I suspect your personal bias towards him personality wise is coloring your assessment
Marvelous Scrappin' [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2pIVQIjnxY"]Marvin Hagler vs Thomas Hearns[/ame]
RJJ started playing pro-am ball and started rapping. He did less training. Manny started in politics and doing all sorts of distractions and not getting enough work done. I see by your post that you have a strong belief in what you say. So do I. I believe that you are wrong. I believe that you swallowed what Floyd said hook, line and sinker, SiB. This is what forums are for. An exchange of views. In this instance, you cannot convince me and I cannot convince you, cest la vie.
Amen Han. I am still a fan of fighters that lost. RJJ, Sakuraba, Spider, Fedor, and Manny. It is like losing takes away all that came before it. No it doesn't.
Dude, you know how much I liked Ricky as a fighter, but who did he actually beat aside from Tszyu that you consider top tier? Castillo who was already shot? Juan Urango? What about when he was almost stopped by Collazo? What about when he was rocked by Lazcano and almost was stopped then? The ref saved him by Ricky needing to have his shoe tied, but he was hurt. Malignaggi aside from Tszyu is the most world class he has beaten. I'm not wearing rose colored glasses here.
I NEVER said Jones was overrated. I said he was athletically gifted and that his fundamentals sucked and they did... he always had his hands low, his overall defense was simply movement with no hands really up... he lost because IMO as I said, he slowed down for that split second due to age or sharpness and now he is killing his legacy by still fighting and getting KO'd multiple times since.
I never said you did, merely that your measure of Nas being overrated was the same as those who decried Jones latterly Jones dominated as a pro and as an amateur - and I mean DOMINATED. His fundemantals were solid, he just applied them differently
I'm sorry, but I don't like Floyd that much outside of the ring... I know that if you base manny's performances over the last few years when ariza brought in his magic pills that suddenly he had this fearsome power and there is a reason for that. I believe that you blindly believe what manny says because he's the nice guy. Ariza is now a KNOWN cheat so to assume that he didn't use illegal substances with his biggest client is ludicrous and down right naïve. Answer this... why did he wait until fighting Rios to do random blood testing when he could have done it in 09 and had the absolute biggest fight likely in boxing history, yet he uses it for Rios, which netted 450k PPV buys vs. the 2.5-3 million he and Floyd could have done... does that make any sense at all to you?
They were fast, fluid, powerful, smooth and they landed more often than they missed His footwork was sublime, his defense borderline impenetrable and his timing was precision itself I would call that solid
Lets not forget RJJ was only a SILVER medalist in the Olympics..... Oh, and in case anybody gets offended, I know the story already, I'm just messing :3
Have to agree with Hannibal on this one. RJJs fundamentals are way better than people give him credit for. The thing is just that RJJ didn't really need these fundamentals when he was in his prime and he was never able to let go of his anti-boxing fighting style even when he slowed down.
From Wiki What I think SiB means is that RJJ does not look like a "normal" boxer, which is not the same as "poor fundamentals"
I loved Naseem and Jones. Love him or hate him, Hamed brought a lot of attention and money to the Featherweight division. I became a fan of people like Morales and Barrera because their names were linked to Hamed. Nas was one hell of a puncher. I believe if he fought Barrera when Warren originally offered Barrera the fight then Hamed would have won. But when the fight finally did come around Hamed got exactly what he deserved - a good hiding. He got big headed, wasn't training properly and thought all he had to do was land one big punch, which to be fair was all he needed a lot of the time. Against the sort of guy Barrera was that was just stupid and disrespectful. I always say it is a shame Pacquiao didn't come along a bit sooner. I know he fought Barrera and Morales, but it was a bit late by then. It was his first fight with Barrera that really caught everyone's eye. The whirlwind Bruce Lee look-a-like! But remembering that Morales outboxed Pacquiao in the 1st fight, I think things might have been a bit different for him fighting a prime Barrera, Naz, Morales, and some of the other very good fighters of that time at Feather. As for Jones, if he retired after the Ruiz fight, wow, what a legend that would have grown into. Up to that point I really was starting to believe he was Superman! To think he had such a weak chin all that time shows how amazing his reflexes were. I was so upset that to all of the fighters he could finally have lost to it had to be Tarver. I never thought Tarver was any good. And then the other guys Jones lost to would never have lived with him in his prime. It's embarrassing. What the hell was he thinking?
Interesting stuff. I heard that both Roy Jones Junior and Prince Naseem Hamed trained in JKD, was that just a rumour?
