Glasgow Duellists at the BFHS Autumn Exchange

Well we're off on tour again this weekend. This time to the British Federation of Historical Swordplay Autumn exchange. Hopefully will be good as it will have representatives from most of the HEMA groups in the UK.
The will be two longsword classes one on Vadi and one Fiore so I'll review those when I get back. Also I'll be watching closely Dave Rawlins I33 class as it will be my first exposure to this style.
Sadly this time the Rabid Hamster is staying home with some pathetic excuse of almost dying with a minor disease but myself, Louie and Marco the italian stallion will all be there.
And of course we will be attempting to freeplay with our Longsword compatriots.

The Bear.

 

I'm looking forewards to your rewievs. I've been to a dave rawlings I-33 seminar some years ago, and back then, he certainly did things with emphaty, and with spirit. I allso look forewards to your rewiev on Fiore, as I primarily focus on fiore.

 

Jeeeez! Don't get him started in Mr Rawlings

Lou

 

Ok this might be alittle long

Tourney:
First news is that the GCoD's Marco took 2nd place at the longsword tourney. Congrats Marco. He was beaten in the final by the old training partner of our Rabid Hamster and fellow German stylist Martin Page. Martin is an excellent fighter and highly experienced so no shame there then. The top three longsword fighters were (remember this was a UK event):

1. Martin Page (Dawn Duellists Society - Edinburgh) German Stylist
2. Marco Novaresio (Glasgow Company of Duellist - Glasgow) German Stylist
3. Kim Young (Aberdeen Swordsmanship Group - Aberdeen) Italian Stylist.

Seminars:
1. The four offensive actions of TE-MA (Mr Peter Holland (Aisle O'var))
This was based on the work of George Silver backsword however included dagger and wrestling elements. This workshop was excellent. Peter explained the concepts clearly and his demonstrations were easy to follow and performed with skill. I still don't know who was tougher Peter or the lady whom was his demonstration partner. She was taking throws on to a concrete floor and not even blinking. I simply loved this seminar, it is the kind you hope is going to happen but very rarely does. My training partner was a feisty German chap half my size but what he lacked in mass he made up in ferocity and we had a great old time to ourselves. Everyone at the end were simply buzzing about George Silver as taught by Mr. Holland.

2. The 3 Ps of i.33 (Dave Rawlins (Boar's Tooth))
Lacking a one handed sword or buckler I was unable to take part in this one however I sat at the side and watched intently as I was very keen to see what Mr. Rawlins taught and to get a feel for the I33 system.
Simply put this seminar was awful. The format was completely wrong and most of the participants has no idea what they should be doing. Dave's descriptions were irrelevant and in fact obstructive to what he was trying to get across. Some of the demonstrations he did were frankly bewildering and some of his behaviour was bordering on the bizzare. Walking around a seminar rambling incoherently with a coffee cup in hand does not go down well with the Bear. He made everyone line up with their finger stuck out then spent 5 minutes pulling finger without explanation. I can't express how disappointed I was in the seminar as it was one of the reason I attended the event. I think Dave certainly hasn't done any favours to I33 nor his own reputation in the British Community.

3. Fiore's longsword (Ms Kim Young (ASG))
I have alot of time for Kim as she is an excellent fighter and always warm and friendly. Her seminar was in an interesting area of Fiore's halfswording techniques. The seminar was well constructed and clearly taught with incremental exercises that everyone could follow. Kim friendly manner and obviously indepth knowledge shone through. There were a couple of principle explainations that could have been added to make it perfect but that's just my perference. Later on the fiore techniques became more complicated and lost martial efficacy in my opinion but we managed to do them after a fashion.

4. Vadi Two handed sword( Matt Noel (DDS))
Another well crafted seminar. However I bowed out early as my left knee wasn't up to Vadi and after going through the guards realising that this style was too fancy and not for me. However it was well taught and easy to follow. Matt certainly knows his stuff but just wasn't my bag. Later on Matt and Greig Watson did a vadi demonstration freeplay that was wonderful to watch.

Anyhoo enough for one post next post will be about freeplay.

The Bear.

 

Hi Bear...

Thought I'd add my 2p worth....

Congrats to Martin & Marco - well done!

Enjoyed all the workshops, top marks going to Aisle O'var - Peter's former experience as an Eastern MA coach certainly showing through.

Next on the list would be Kim's Fiori workshop, all on half-swording which while interesting isn't something most of us will take into a fight unless blows to our padded armour don't count and looseplay is won by getting your point inbetween the gaps :evil:
Only negative point would be the sound level - was difficult to hear her with other session going on in the background.

As to Vadi Agree with you there, not my bag either but for those practicing Italian Longsword ....

The Vadi was interesting in that (with some knowledge of Fiore's work) you could see how much it had changed from Fiore's days and been adapted to fit a later period, less armour & influences of other sword styles creeping in - very formal, short stances, shorter cutting arcs, power generated more from turning the hips rather than putting the whole body behind the blow.

Hats off to Matt and Greig for interpreting so much out of a manuscript that is fairly sparse in comparison to many others, and making it work during their demo.

No buckler so no I.33 either but noticed quite a lot of participants dropped out and the vibe wasn't great afterwards - so Nill Ponts.

Most valuable lesson of the two days was the freeplay - but dissapointed that everyone wasn't frogmarched into trying some longsword fighting on Sunday - the three of us were standing about looking for someone else to fight but we weren't getting many offers - despite my pleading eyes
They should make it compulsory, no shirking and no bloody space-hopper jousting!:lowblow:

Louie

 

Part 2: Freeplay and event in general

Freeplay:
Well I had 6 bouts of freeplay at the event. I ask two other people to fight but neither were able or willing.

My first being against longsword tourney champion Martin Page. I asked to fight against his 40" sword vs. my 36" sword because he has been championing the longer weapon and I wanted to see if it really was advantageous. I found my shorter sword has faster and effectively counter his longer reach. It was a very close match, perhaps too close to call. Sp close that Martin wanted another fight next day using his 36" sword. More on that later.

My second bout was with Martin's compatriot Lukas who has just returned from a long recovery period and was severely out of condition. I stopped this one early as I could see he needed time to get him conditioned to fighting again.

My Third bout was against Louie. Which decended pretty smartly into our usual scrappy affair or kicking and hand mashing but we fight almost every week so we know each other tricks too well.

My fourth Bout was Martin Page with his 36" sword. This time he was quicker and able to use the new scheilhau effectively however he only landed minor hand hit with it. Again the match was very even. His experience countered my speed and strength. He landed one very clean disembowelling stroke which I returned in short order. Again too close to call.

My fifth fight was against Marco. This was an unusual fight as we decided to be abit flashy and try some different things. I did alot of strikes over the top of his guard which proved very troublesome for him and even managed a throw. Marco threw some interesting transforming strikes.

My last fight was against a chap who I don't know. I just grabbed him and ask for a fight because nobody else was willing. He was, like myself is not very experienced. However he was not prepared for the aggressive German system. One of my first thrusts to his head took him off his feet and onto his back. After that it was a rout. Throwing rapid thrusts and quick cuts and constantly attacking the chap, he did his best but couldn't land a hit. Also once I closed to grappling he didn't have an answer. It was my first encounter with an italian stylist, desparate to see how I would fare against a more experienced swordsman of the Italian style.

Event:
Overall the event was excellent, brilliantly organised by the Dawn Duellists. The atmosphere was very friendly and alot of interesting things were shown. Well worth the cost of attending.

The Bear.

 

Lets be fair Bear, not many people do have an answer when they grapple with you! :woo:

 

COMPETITION/FREEPLAY
Over the event I took part in around 9 bouts which included competition & freeplay. During the competition I had bouts with both Marco and Martin who went on to take 1st & 2nd place, hats off to these guys.

As my first attempt at these rules it was unusual to find the judges asking if your opponent scored a point against you, and finding that a strike which would have disembowelled your opponent only scored 1 point while his cut which would have nicked your ear, scores 3

During the competition I identified an opponent I had real difficulty catching - not sure which club but I think he was of the Italian style - He had a longer blade, long reach, quick ficks & turns of the blade, very fast, very fit.
I singled him out for a bit of freeplay later and eventually found that the only way to counter him was either get in close & trap his hand and use the pommel or use the Kron guard which caught a lot of his strikes on the cross-piece.... I'm going to end up turning into Harvey Keitel's character in the Duellists and chasing him around Britian!

My last Freeplay bout was against Autumn Exchange winner, Martin - again I found the hand trap or catching the blade very successful. The bout ended when a straight thrust caught him between the joints of his glove. Fearing a repeat of an injury given to him by the Hamster a few years ago, he retired to seek treatment to his hand - luckily the sword hadn't penetrated the glove and he was able to continue.

Great event, Well done DDS and the BFHS!:happy:

Louie

 

Martin ended up with stitches and an infection (no, I dont marinate my sword in pooh no matter what the rumors say!) in his hand after his savaging by that most Rabid of Hamsters.
The fun we had at A&E when the young female doctor seemed to think the police needed to be informed of a fencing accident! She also handed a form to Martin when we left for a claims company so that he could sue me.
When I drove him home ... I was hesitant about going in for a coffee expecting his wife to go off on one at me. She did go off on one ... but at martin for being stupid and it was his own fault.

 

OOOOPSSS! Forgot to thank Bear for gettin Marco & Me there and back safely

Louie

 

Not many people have an answer for grappling, PERIOD, END OF STATEMENT.

It only gets more complicated when you thow weapons into the mix.

I find that the easiest thing to teach (and perform, actually) is to use the weapon to bind the opponents weapon then work for a body-throw or trip. Those work on simple principles of balance and leverage and you don't have to "worry" about what to "do" with the weapon. Just keep it binding up the opponents.

After you get a handle on that aspect, only THEN work on learning weapon "hooks," two-handed winds at-at-the-grapple, etc.

I'm not sure about the German longsword tradition, but (from my admittedly cursory examination) it seems to follow that sort of progression with some of the Italian stuff (not that I'm any expert in that, mind you). Start off with the unarmed grappling and after that mix in how to do it while holding weapons. This makes a great deal of sense to me.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

From what I read, I think I'm not ready to meet you yet. So far we've only sparred with face and hand protection, but we're about to start sparring with more protection on our body, so I guess, in a years time, I might be ready for you (not nessesarily to win, but to be able to spar with you without beeing a hazard to myself )

Sorry to hear about Rawlings I-33. It would be interresting to have been there to find out wether it's you who do not get it, if it's me who didn't get it when I was attending his seminar some 4 years ago, or if it's a bit of both.

 

Wish his fencing was a girly as his driving! :lowblow:

 

The Backsword/Sabre tournament…

The Backsword/Sabre tournament…

Competitors consisted of leading UK instructors and students along with fighters from other European schools of fence.

Competitors had to fight through several rounds to reach the final. The swordsmanship throughout the tournament was of the highest calibre. It was a joy to watch the cream of Europe’s swordsmen and women fight it out and to literally see the sparks flying!!!

The final was between Emma ‘The Viking’ Boast and Pete ‘Buzzsaw’ Holland both members of the Aisle O’var Backswording Clubbe. The spectators were enthralled by the fast exchanges of swordplay throughout the final as both combatants fought for the honour of becoming the Champion. The spectators cheered and clapped when in the end Pete ‘Buzzsaw’ Holland won the Glorianna Cup and the title of UK Backsword Champion 2008. The presentation was held later that evening at the Cannons Gait Pub in the City centre.

When asked about what it felt like to win the Glorianna cup and to become the UK’s Backsword Champion, Pete replied “It feels great and means so much its hard to put in to words. We all trained hard for this year’s tournament after Steve ‘The Bulldog’ won it last year. That means the AOBC is the first club to hold the cup 2 years running so it’s all to play for next year.”

The winners of the Rapier and Longsword tournaments were..

Chris Barker of the SSS Durham - Rapier Champion
Martin Page of the DDS - Longsword Champion

 

That'll be me then,
Mark Lancaster told me about this forum at training yesterday so I thought I'd stop by and say Hello.
I had a great time at the Autumn exchange and pretty much agree with Bear's review of the workshops.
It was cool to have a go at some freeplay as well, I learned a lot from sparring with you guys and look forward to crossing swords with you again.
Are any of you thinking about getting down to SWASH 09?

 

Ah fantastic. Welcome to MAP.
Yeah I was just pleased to get an fight outside the GCoD and DDS german brigade. Looking forward to our next freeplay, you have good fighting spirit and now you know what expect I hope next time I get a good thrashing from you.
Hopefully I will make it to SWASH but it depends on the post-xmas finances. I have to pay for the BFHS instructor course in January was well I believe.

The Bear.

 

Hi Steel Bonnet.... welcome to the MAP!
Nice to have met you (We did a bit of freeplay on the Saturday after the competition).
Hmmmmm two choices, go to SWASH or spend the money on a new sword or two?

Louie

 

well it was pretty expensive for SWASH this year ... at times I wasn't sure it was worth quite what I spent over the weekend (£250 at least) ... but I did enjoy it.

Wandering around the armouries like we owned the place trailing bag of swords was amusing when you saw the normal punters faces! - they must have thought we were nicking the exhibits.
Dinner in the hall of war was cool as was getting leathered with author and noted byzantine gnu Tim Dawson.
Much gossing about swords till 2am in the morn was fun and at times bizarre
AND seeing the state of the DDS secretary on the sunday morn was hysterical.

Still undecided if I'm doing it again mainly cause I DONT EVER ****ING WELL WANT TO SIT THROUGH ANOTHER BFHS COMMITTEE MEETING NOT NEVER NOT NO HOW! and I shall challenge and kill in cold blood any man who suggests I do.
However enough GCoD decide to go and I may be persuaded ... with several large whiskys.

 

Hi guys. That weekend was the first time I'd fought anyone outside of our small study group, I hope I can offer more of a challenge next time.
If you can't get down for SWASH let me know of any local events/workshops Glasgow ain't really that far from Cumbria so I might be able to travel up and take part.

 

You'll need to adopt the German method then

Louie