Lompat is literally jump! Kekuatan Lompat to be exact. Jumping energy/power. However in context it is the old coiled spring cliche. You can get a lot of 'springy' power from the kuda-kuda
From a mechanical point of view standing motionless in deep Kuda-kuda won’t help much with being able to jump high. If you cook a chicken you will see that the meat in the legs is dark whilst the breast meat is white. The reason for this is that there are two different types of muscle present, fast twitch muscle (breast) is white and slow twitch muscle (legs) is red. For jumping you need to develop white twitch muscle for explosive movement. Standing motionless in deep Kuda-kuda will develop slow twitch muscle which is for endurance and not much help in jumping. If you want to be able to jump high the training for that should be jumping, perhaps from Kuda-kuda. In old times this was practiced by standing in a pit and jumping out but you could also practice jumping up onto a table as it’s the same thing. This is more a mechanical point of view or muscle development for explosive movement as jumping energy is something quite different and developed in a different way but not unrelated.
That's Oroit yow Narrue, it was only an assumption from translation. I may be totally wrong here, but I expect it may be more to do with the potentiel power generated from movement out of kuda kuda. Certainly, we don't tend to hang around in kuda2, but it is more of a transitionary stance. let's put it this way. Facing forward in kuda2, you step 180 to the left with your right leg whilst maintaining the same forward body position and foot position of the left leg. You have now wound up a serious amount of body torque. We do an elbow strike to the back of the opponents neck from that position that is totally evil Dunno if this is what Bela 'brummie' diri meant, but I'm sure he'll elucidate. Narrue, thanks for the new perspective on kuda2 and muscle development. I have been putting a lot of work into 'springing' up from low positions lately and have noticed a more distinct 'twang' that I'm getting from my legs. You do realise I'm gonna be jumping out of kuda 2 now. I think I'll give the tables a miss though. If I broke the dining table I'd be daging kuda in no time
Kuda-Kuda Peace and blessings to all, The word kuda-kuda means base although kuda does mean horse. In architecture, kuda-kuda is tha base that supports the roof, often shaped like and A-frame. The horse stance is one kuda-kuda, but there are many other types of kuda-kuda, beginning from lying on the floor, siting on the ground, till standing on one leg. All these base positions are called kuda-kuda. When you talk about other MA in Indonesian you can also use the word kuda-kuda, thus there are obvious kuda-kuda in Karate and less obvious kuda-kuda in Boxing. In the Chinese silat I learn we call kuda-kuda either kuda-kuda or beshi and we imagine that beshi is the Chinese word for kuda-kuda. Indonesia is a big place but China is even bigger. Warm salaams to all, KC.
hi every one Ok what i meant by lompat energy was the ability jump in and out of a posture. Remember that i see kuda kuda as a kick not as a posture (wheather this is right or wrong). Yesterday i was clearing the attack line by jumping sideways then jumping back into low posture to deliver the kick which follows through and back into upright posture thats all. There is several variations on some of our low horse postures but its all to do with where the opponent is. I think we all have them its not new or secert its just another truth in combat where idea's concepts & systems over lap. This happens so much in silat thats why i am addicted to learning it. The learning curve ALWAYS rises and every lesson is challenge, constantly removing the comfort zone. regards bela brummie diri
Bela Diri, This is what I thought, the energy created from moving in and out of kudu-kuda. And we definitely do seem to some overlap between our respective styles If move between langkahs there is always a kick there, but it's never obvious. And they are not kicks in the more cliched hollywood styles of MA kicks. Subtle and crafty they are! At first when I was taught my initial langkahs I was a little bewildered when I was told 'thats also a kick' But as you say, the learning curve rises, and with each lesson the subtleties become more apparent. Good stuff indeed!
Salam everyone, Kiai you are absolutely right >At first when I was taught my initial langkahs I was a little bewildered when I was told 'thats also a kick' *********** I was buffled a bit when bela diri said kuda-kuda is a kick. ;( And then GS saying the same thing? Now I understand why, at any time, you are lifting your leg either for weight-transfer/transition, that leg can be use to kicks or to sweep, etc. But that process alone is not kuda-kuda. I agree with Kiai, kuda-kuda is a base, PERIOD My dad was station in Bukit Tinggi for two years, I was 13 at that time. Lemme tell you, we had a lot of visitors, mostly silat elders to our house on weekend. I saw what a base it, it was ver low to the ground, like their butt just planted to the ground...what a painful exercise it was... Tristan
Sorry Pak OJ, I didn't mean that the actual Kuda-Kuda was a kick, it is a good solid base. However, as you rightly said moving to and from kuda2 can be used for beset or sapu etc. Aren't we all saying pretty much the same here?
Shifting kuda-kuda Tak ada kuda-kuda yang tak bisa digempur Maka itu geseran adalah utama (Rendra) There is no base that can't be crushed So shifting is of paramount importance (Rendra) For those of you who are not up-to-date on contemporary Indonesian poetry, Rendra is a famous Indonesian poet and silat practitioner, and my teacher. Warm salaams to all, KC.
O I see, you are talking about power developed from gelek (twisting) Yes jumping from horse stance will improve your ability to jump high. You could also try harimau jumping which uses the arms and legs at the same time. Footballers train bunny hops to improve leg strength but a friend of mine who recently had a knee operation says it was from doing such exercise that damaged his knees so I would not recommend bunny hops.
Yes jumping from horse stance will improve your ability to jump high. You could also try harimau jumping which uses the arms and legs at the same time. Footballers train bunny hops to improve leg strength but a friend of mine who recently had a knee operation says it was from doing such exercise that damaged his knees so I would not recommend bunny hops. *********************** I respectfully disagree! Horse stance will makes you feel immobilized to jump....Totally garbage! Running start will help you to jump higher, have you ever saw how orang Nias jump? Have you ever saw silat guys jump?, they usually have a running start. Some jump from the base but not from horse stance, usually from natural stance with the knee slightly bend and is use to spring upward. A horse stance is a transitional stance just like front stance or cat stance, etc. Anyone that claim that they can fight with a horse stance as a base, either he/she never fight outside the perguruan/dojo or at the very least in the martial arts tournament. Unless you have a ball of steel or iron legs bolted to the ground And I could be wrong too, as usual ;( Tristan
Running and jumping is just a way to build up momentum but that momentum is forward in the direction of running so the running does not help you jump higher but further i.e. in a horizontal direction. If you want to train jumping than you need to train in a vertical movement i.e. jumping upwards as this will build muscle in the same way squats build muscle. However the difference with squatting and jumping is that jumping will build the white fast twitch muscle needed for jumping.
Salam Narrue, >Yes jumping from horse stance will improve your ability to jump high. In my five decades of learning silat, I have never saw anyone jump from horse stance. Would you care to show me? I'm willing to listen and learn. For exercise Yes, indeed. Its good to build a mucles group, but not to JUMP for the horse stance. At the very least I have never see it being done or I have never learn it. So take like it is. And I could be wrong too, Tristan
One more thing Narrue, What is your purpose of jumping upward in silat? Especially from horse stance? My beginer's mind wonder...This is not a movie flick influence, right? Tristan
There is a difference from training and application. I am not saying that it is used in application but training. For example in fighting how do you apply a push up, sit-up, crunch etc etc, they are all used for training purposes and not application.
There is a difference from training and application. I am not saying that it is used in application but training. ********************* Aha! We finally agree on something! >For example in fighting how do you apply a push up, sit-up, crunch etc etc, they are all used for training purposes and not application *************** Well we did differently than the masses, we tought to warm-up as student responsiblity. When the class start, we do not do those warm-up exercises. I would rather to repeat the juru hunderd time than push up hundred times. The muscles group use are different between push-up/sit-up than the actual silat practice. I'm not saying the push-up/sit-up is wrong exercises and not beneficial to silat, I'm only saying that warm-up is good for warm-up. And I could be wrong too, Tristan
in mande muda, some of the langkah harimau involve 'jumping' from horse stance to depok, and from depok to horse stance, but that's as close as we get. the kuda-kuda my guru teaches includes the horse stance as well as other postures and stepping. sapu and 'stepping kicks' are taught from what we call jurus kaki. tim
as tim stl said in mande-muda, we train kuda-kuda a few ways all in all there seems to be a strong emphasis on the strong fluid stance that doesn't leave the legs weak an open to attacks like a horse.
