For the Sake of Clarification

Discussion in 'Jeet Kune Do' started by Vajrayana, Mar 27, 2012.

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  1. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    Exactly, and how can you discard something as being useless unless you have practiced it to death and know it inside out, for if you dont you may well be discarding something that is actually very usefull and you just dont know it simply becuase you suck at it.

    And if you have never done it to any great degree you cant discard it, because you dont have it. That's like me saying i'm going to discard all your cash because it is of no use to me but I will keep my cash because I can buy things with it. Hence making it usefull.
     
  2. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    I spent more time with Bruce Lee.... :)

    I read all of his books and watched all of his movies many times over. :rolleyes:

    Seriously, the JKD Totem Pole is like others;

    Once the founder or main instructor is gone, everyone come out of the wood work trying to be at the top

    Then there is;

    If_____(insert name) was still alive, they would_________(insert your opinion)
     
  3. Mharewood

    Mharewood Valued Member

     
  4. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

     
  5. Mharewood

    Mharewood Valued Member

    Doesn't sound like it


    As James Lee stated The JKD process was all about working on developing a Master Key to unlock all locks. You & these other guys idea however seems to be to work on a Key chain full of keys. THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION

    and Time spent Practicing JKD will make you better at JKD.

    This comment of yours tells me everything about you and how delluded you are about JKD! The idea behind using Bruces tools and Methods has nothing to do with doing things to the letter or following him blindly. Its a realisation of why he funneled things to the level he did and that if you want to continue that process the top of your funnel should be even narrower than the bottom of the first. Its about learning to do more with less techniques. learning more ways of applying the same techniques to different senarios. finding creative ways of applying the same methods. finding out that the best place to start is where he left things. And fine tuning those methods and tools even further. We are not following any person! But a path he identified. There is a big difference.

    No its not rubbish! its an opinion and hence why I stated "I believe" and I have a reason behind why I do. and its not a "pointless argument" because I made it and its a statement... until ofcourse someone starts to pointlessly argue with it who has no reasoning behind why they don't agree.


    That's what Hannibal said not me read the threads
     
  6. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    I feel like that was stated in order to establish that kali has nothing to do with JKD. Which is odd, given that Guro Dan Inosanto was there from the inception of JKD. He's been involved in JKD for longer, now, than almost anyone else currently on the planet.
     
  7. Mharewood

    Mharewood Valued Member

    Except ofcourse Inosanto himself admitted Kali was not part of JKD and taught it separately as an art. He even said Bruce took a grim view of FMA as a whole but did like certain aspect of it like Largo Mano.
     
  8. Simon

    Simon Back once again Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    Mharewood, where are you based? I'd love to get together and run through some of your theories and compare them to my own.
     
  9. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    I believe Inosanto's stance is that kali was not a part of Bruce Lee's JKD. My point being that the other guy who was there from Day 1 (Dan Inosanto) probably should be given a fair amount of consideration in terms of how JKD evolves as well.

    As for teaching them separately, I think that comes down to two things: 1) FMA certainly can stand on its own merits and doesn't need to be taught as part of JKD. And 2) opening a kali school that also offered JKD classes to a select few students was Guro Dan's and Guro Richard Bustillo's attempt to reconcile the conflicting impulses to honour Lee's wish that there NOT be "JKD schools" and to ensure that JKD didn't die with Lee himself.

    Now, let's put aside, for a minute, the question of who said what. Let's look at principles or concepts or whatever. JKD is supposed to be a "street art." Is it fair to say that street altercations frequently involve weapons, makeshift or otherwise? If so, how is it not consistent with the principles of JKD to practice skills related to impact and bladed weapons of all sizes?

    Moreover, the previously cited "largo mano" is a very clear example of Lee's "longest weapon to nearest target" principle. And it's a staple of kali theory as well.

    I feel like the rejection of/adherence to kali as it relates to JKD has become more political than technical. And that the discussion would benefit a great deal if we could take a step back and look at the actual movements involved.


    Stuart
     
  10. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    "JKD-Next to Chi, the most misunderstood and debated martial art subject for the century."
     
  11. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    Realy me and those other guys??? There you go assuming you know me yet you know nothing about me, go talk to 'Those other guys' and even they will tell you you certainly cant group me with them either, I dont do concepts and I dont do OJKD either, I do Pat O'Malley.


    I certainly have no delusions about it at all, but I know a few delusional people who say that it has all the answers. Like I said, you know nothing of me so dont even try to judge me or put me in a box and try to catagorise me, because that certainly aint me. But I do understand one thing, you certainly think you have all the answers and your the usual I do it right and all the others do it wrong yet I would lay money on it that you cant actually show us why you are right and all the others are wrong.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2012
  12. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Mharewood I also notice you have not listed your lineage -

    For reference here is mine - I hold Full Instructor rank

    Primary - Bruce Lee -> Dan Inosanto -> Paul Vunak -> Me
    Secondary - Bruce Lee -> Dan Inosanto -> Paul Vunak -> Jack McVicker -> Me
    Tertiary - Bruce Lee -> Richard Bustillo -> Lee Banda -> Me
    Quaterny - Bruce Lee -> Dan Inosanto -> Bob Breen -> Lee Banda -> Me
    Quinary - Bruce Lee -> Dan Inosanto -> Steve Powell -> Steve Crutchley -> Me

    This does not include my other training in other arts with other teachers of course, but it is the most pertinent. They descend in order of the length of time I have spent with each individual.

    Your turn
     
  13. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    CHECKMATE

    *hears crickets chirping*
     
  14. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    *tumbleweed rolls by*
     
  15. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    *dead silence much after a nuke explosion*
     
  16. shootodog

    shootodog restless native

    what happened to sheever? he didn't post his lineage?
     
  17. Mharewood

    Mharewood Valued Member

    Checkmate??? All he did was prove that his view of JKD has been distorted from the start by the "C0NC3PT5" philosophy which has mainly pushed JKD in the opposite direction in practice
    look at the common string
    Bruce Lee -> Dan Inosanto
    Bruce Lee -> Richard Bustillo
    Bruce Lee -> Dan Inosanto
    Bruce Lee -> Richard Bustillo

    Me on the other hand have been trained by people with lineage back toTed Wong, Bob Bremer, Larry Hartsell, Dan inosanto, , Howard Williams, Leo Fong as well Bruce Lees First Student Jesse Glover. I have been trained by some of these people directly too So my conclusions are based on a much more balanced perspective.

    Either way if he is that naive that he thinks his lineage qualifies him in my mind then he is in la la land! LMAO Lineage is not what makes a teacher good, but how he teaches and relays what bruce taught. If its not Pure Jeet Kune Do...Its Jeet Kune Don't. I am convinced of that more than ever1
     
  18. Mharewood

    Mharewood Valued Member



    while you are fussing over this Discard and Disregard nonesense

    If I HAVE 9 months of grappling experience in a school that specialises in it then that is something that I HAVE and I can choose to DISCARD or DISREGARD or SHELVE that experience if I choose or because I find that it does not fit in with my training criteria or schedule. You will only OWN something if you are a complete expert at it.
    No matter how poor you think the level of competition I got in those grappling classes was on the whole it certainly was much better than you will ever get in these “Wanna be JKD” clubs that think they are making you a more complete fighter just because they are imitating MMA clubs
     
  19. shootodog

    shootodog restless native

    so your lineage is?
     
  20. Mangosteen

    Mangosteen Hold strong not

    so how do you define JKD?
    in simple terms.

    nah, leave sheever alone. he's a cool guy, just a bit of a groupie and idolises his teachers to much.
     
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