FMA for a new guy

Good post, Pieman. You've identified what's important to you. That's a good start. It may be that, ultimately, you decide differently. But I certainly wouldn't say you've misspoken. You've been honest and decisive. Nothing to feel badly about there.

 

Question re: the empty hands stuff. Always seen it as a mixture of Wing Chun, boxing and Muay Thai clinchwork myself. Bearing in mind my first-hand experience is pretty much limited to the stuff I've seen on the Internet and in Jason Bourne movies. Is this comparison anywhere close to reality? Are there other arts it is similar to so I can make mental references to them?

 

Dumog can look similar to Ju Jutsu at times,

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6As1h54LKzc"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6As1h54LKzc[/ame]

but FMA is very much it's own animal - even when unarmed the concept of the hand being the weapon is at the forefront.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYeaPLrPgRo"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYeaPLrPgRo[/ame]

 

There is no consistent FMA empty hand. Depends very much on the background of the person teaching. Some people's will be very (kick)boxing based. Others very jiujutsu based. Or karate. Or taekwondo. Etc.

There are maneuvers that are characteristic of FMA empty hand. But they're far from universal. Need more information before you can take anything more than a wild guess at what their empty hand will look like.

For instance, if you're literally looking at the Bourne movies, they're choreographed by Jeff Imada, student of Dan Inosanto. Seeing some wing chun, boxing, muay thai clinchwork, etc. makes sense then, as Guro Dan incorporates all three into his overall approach to kali.

 

Ah cool. Thank you for the explanations.

 

Yeah mate - still in SOAS WC1X 9EW. Taught a class this evening actually, covering singlestick flow drills, dagger variants and some off-body chambering/halfbeat work with the dagger. Hopefully you'll get yourself along to one of the classes soon (keep an eye on the website for any class cancellations as they can be a bit funny around the August bank holiday).

On a side note, one of my students is putting together some more footage, so there should hopefully be a bit more going up soon

 

I had not noticed that FMA was so prevalent in TV/movies -

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdr-7VHsZ6c"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zdr-7VHsZ6c[/ame]

Although I guess that other MA use sticks of some sort to.

I see most schools do grading, what's the belt system like in FMA?

 

Depending on the school/system there may or may not be a belt system, some schools without belts do gradings of rank that aren't visibly represented, and others don't do any grading. Sort of like the curriculums, FMAs are about that standardized.

 

Rofl . So with a lack of standardisation how does one know if what they are being taught is any good especially when you are told you are attending kali lessons but the art itself is pretty wide open to interpretation with the instructor throwing in their own experiences as said in another post earlier??

 

How do you know a boxer is any good?

It's all in the way they move - watch the mechanics of the body and it will tell you everything you need to know

For example: This is Guro Dan (probably my single biggest Idol in Martial Arts). Watch his mechanics and how even in this demo they are seemless

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M_690at61o"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M_690at61o[/ame]

This is Eric "Top Dog" Knauss of the Dog Brothers - one of the best stick fighters of the modern generation. There is a difference in the style, but the same sort of "flow"to his mechanics

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WoMgotN90I"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WoMgotN90I[/ame]

This on the other hand is one of the internets resident jokes - "Choson Ninja". Not being content with sucking at made up "ninjitsu" he sucks at kali/escrima too

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vSRk5rWBxM"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vSRk5rWBxM[/ame]

Ranks can be bought and certificates can lie, but the body tells all

 

Hannibal makes a very good point about movement and flow, but then again, sometimes this is difficult for someone new to martial arts (or new to FMA) to pick up immediately.

One way to get an idea for the instructor's fluidity is to wait until, when demonstrating a particular drill or technique, their feeder (demonstration partner) does something unexpected - does the instructor get hit? Stop the drill woodenly and then reset? Carry on as if nothing happened and explain afterwards? Trigger 'berserker mode' and destroy everyone p)?

If they are smooth, talk throughout the drill, explain that there were a few unexpected things in there, but that's ok... Then these are all good signs.

Although, having said that, if they smoothly carry on as if nothing untoward had happened, then you would need to know the drill well enough to understand that the reaction occurred!

Hmm, somewhat chicken and egg...

 

Depends on which system you're referring to. Here's some food for thought:

http://www.pekiti-tirsia.net/openHand.php

 

Point taken - watch the instructor see how they rock and roll - on that same vein what's the signs of a horrible teacher?

Just to show I am contributing to the conversation:

I am going to go for cobra kai (Karate Kid:hatdude as blatantly bad example, conversely the little Okinawan dude was the better teacher, he moved like a cat, but if someone asked me to wax his cars I would definitely think he was taking the Michael!

 

A lack of fluidity would be a warning sign. FMA is a pretty broad category, so it's difficult to give specific warning signs. But one constant is fluidity. If their weapon handling looks awkward, don't immediately dismiss that concern just because you're new. If you saw the clips Hannibal posted and recognized his point about flow, I think you instinctually know a lot of what you need to know. It's not foolproof.

If you have information on their background, weigh it carefully. FMA gets treated as a sort of add-on module by some people. They attend a seminar or two and then start spouting off that they incorporate FMA into their curriculum. I can't stress enough that FMA is a full system (or systems), worthy of a lifetime of study on their own. Though it's not uncommon at all for FMA exponents to be crosstrained in something else. That's as true of the legendary masters as it is of Joe Gunting the relative newbie. But they should have had some dedicated study of FMA stretched over years, versus a couple of certificates from one-day seminars.

 

If your looking to cross train you can't go wrong with Bob. I know I trained with him for many years.

As for situational awareness, hand to hand, practical knife awareness the I would say Andy Janson of the London Arnis Group. He is one of my top guys and a profession body guard and trainer of body guards himself. He is often travelling to globe in his work and puts together some top body guard teams. He has practical hands on application of the FMA in his stress environments.

But why not do both. I often visit his group in London running intensive courses in fact I will be back there in November.

Best of luck

Pat.

 

Thanks for response - I think my issue is at the moment I am like a kid in a sweet shop and want to do everything! I can't do anything for a few more weeks but intend to come along to Bob's academy and the London Arnis Group for starters, hoping I get hooked but worst case I will know its not for me. But am now firmly of the opinion that I would rather have some skills that are of practical use, rather than being a x belt in system y and getting my butt handed to me at least to start with - not that I am expecting or looking for trouble lol.

 

I don't think either group would hand you your butt but rather they would bring you up gradually to do the handing.

 

This is the reason "subukan" (translates to "to test", but really means to fight to the "death") has existed. To prevent jokes like him from popping up.

 

Good FMA is all about flow.

Reposting my friend/ teacher/ (tor)mentor's club's promo clip.

Roland Isla's KDL- IMK

http://http://youtu.be/6paNdmXx7m8

 

Moving and hitting hard simultaneously.