FMA disarms/stick by beltless

Discussion in 'Filipino Martial Arts' started by Cannibal Bob, Sep 6, 2006.

  1. Beltless

    Beltless Banned Banned

    Well, I've trained with Inosanto, not one of his instructors, and not at some seminar like most people. And quite frankly if you think 10, 20 or 30 years makes a world of difference in this universe for something as timeless as the martial arts then go ahead. I've trained, applied, triumphed and lost what i preach. Again I'm not preaching how good I am, because obviously 15 years is worthless experience in everyone's almighty eyes, but discussing overlooked FMA principles in this particular group of full-contact fighters. and so what? Are they too proud to admit they could modify or even consider mild alternatives to the way they do things? Maybe it would make them better fighters. Maybe not. But what's the harm in trying? Nobody reaches the end of their road to ultimate potential in martial arts.

    Look, you think these "magic :rolleyes: " principles in knife/stick defence are unfounded and just don't cut-it in the real world. I don't believe that, and that's from experience, not because Mr. white bearded chinese dude with a cane said so in a book. Many things are possible with proper training and confidence in yourself.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2006
  2. MaverickZ

    MaverickZ Guest

    you're full of it
     
  3. Beltless

    Beltless Banned Banned

    You've had nothing useful to say on this argument, no really you haven't. And I'm expected to back my claims up with thoughtful explanations for people like you? Stupid of me.
     
  4. MaverickZ

    MaverickZ Guest

    with the kind of statements you're making? yes
     
  5. Beltless

    Beltless Banned Banned

    My point is that instead of putting equal efforts in your replies, you're just mocking them. Rather you're mocking me, it's all too personal with everyone, "who cares what they say, what matters is who said it!" type of thing. If so then allready I better remove myself from this topic of "discussion".
     
  6. MaverickZ

    MaverickZ Guest

    2006 - 1988 = 18

    18 - 15 = 3

    you started your FMA training when you were 3?
     
  7. Tommy-2guns...

    Tommy-2guns... southpaw glassjaw

    can(or has) someone enter/entered the gathering using anything other than FMA weaponry such as shinai,bekken, any other wooden weapon ala 3 section staff or nunchaku? im just curious as itd be interesting to see that sort of thing.


    i think anyman with the balls to fight no rules with a big stick would make rooservelt proud.

    and do those fencing masks give any good protection to the face when hit with something other than a fencing epee/foil/sabre, i imadgine the cage/and face would get rather dented.

    FMA has never and probably never will be my thing but these guys deserve every martial artist respect, and if you dont see the art in what they are doing then your head is obviously deep down in your crap canyon.
     
  8. Tommy-2guns...

    Tommy-2guns... southpaw glassjaw

    hey man dont underestimate FMA of the three year olds, they fight dirty,squirt milk in your eye and use the double spoon to beat down on your sorry ass. ocasionally they crap in a nappy tape it to your face and then punch you in said face repeatedly. deadly....so deadly
     
  9. Taliesin

    Taliesin Valued Member

    hosepipe

    I seem to remember reading somewhare about somebody wanting to use a "garden hosepipe" as his weapon of choice at one of these gatherings :eek:
     
  10. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    His profile says FMA (5 years). Don't know if he changed it or not, but that's what it says.
     
  11. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    Now let me see if I understand some of the concerns here...

    Look when I have a stick in my hand and someone attacks me, I'm going to use it like an impact weapon, not like a sword. Swords cut along the length of the blade and they often have a nice point on them for thrusting. Impact weapons generate their force near the end of the weapon.

    Hence, striking with an impact weapon is different than cutting with a blade. If a stick is to represent a sword, that's fine for training but not for fighting...

    It makes sense that Dog Brother's combat is going to start to resemble what works for that environment. A stick is used like an impact weapon because it is a stick and not a blade. Grappling is going to be used a bit more because people are wearing armor that gives them some protection from the strikes slowing people down and allowing for the closing of the gap while taking a hit.

    Look at point sparring in karate, often referred to as a game of tag. Didn't start that way, but because of the rules and environment, speed and movement with skill became a primarily factor that determined the outcome of the contest.

    So not everything in a Dog Brother's competition is going to apply to a situation where there is no armor and it is bladed weapons combat... What I don't understand is that everyone seems to realize this, especially the Dog Brother's participants, and if everyone is in agreement... What then is the issue? What is the debate between Beltless and others all about?
     
  12. MaverickZ

    MaverickZ Guest

    apparently he changed it within the last hour
    sooo:

    Jun fan/JKD - 4th rank
    Muay Thai
    TKD[wtf] - 2nd dan
    Wado ryu - 1st dan
    Shotokah(lol)n - 2nd dan
    FMA - 5 years
    Kickboxing - 3 years (i'm assuming this is the Muay Thai)
    Hung Gar kung fu - 2 years
    Choy-Li fut - 2 years
    Wing Chun - 6 years

    just so we're clear, that is 20+ years worth of experience. i'm not saying that's impossible, since he could have actually studying more than one style at a time. but really... come now.....
     
  13. Matt_Bernius

    Matt_Bernius a student and a teacher

    They are always up for it. Most FMA compeitions are like this. I once almost got to go full contact (in a non DBA event) against someone using a wooden ring. Wearing a kilt (he was... wearing a kilt). Yeah... I'm still a little bummed that the mixed weapons category was cancelled.

    Not always. Note that sword construction varries depending on where you are. Some swords, machetes and knives (remembering that a knife in the Phillipines can be as long as one's forearm) may only be bladed at the tip. As such, many FMA's stress not only hitting with the tip but engaging with a draw back, slicing pull out of the hit.

    And as far as thrusting, while sword points are scary stuff, anyone who has gotten a punyo or punta (stick butt or tip) anywhere near their eye, can appreciate how good a stick can be used for thrusting. In fact, the bayonette stick technique is a wonderful one to use against a close range grappler type (if you can pull it off).

    While a stick might not be a good model or a Kitana, it isn't a bad choice for someone training Espada, bolo, or many other FMA weapons. That said, folks are right in understanding that, at the end of the day, stick combat is stick combat and blades are something else.

    - Matt
     
  14. Matt_Bernius

    Matt_Bernius a student and a teacher

    Interesting. First of all, no offense but the first retreat of a cornered internet warrior is spelling correction.

    Secondly, can you explain exactly how someone in England has spent so much time with Guro Inosanto? Unless you moved recently from LA, then you're at best doing modified seminar work like many of the people on this board (myself included). Oh, and there are people here who do train directly at the academy.

    Next, being that you don't seem to recognize or acknoweldge names like Leo Gaje (who a number of people here do in fact train directly under) -- well, what can I say, it's nice living in a secluded world.

    Also, a number of the Dog Brothers, including Mark Denny, are all Inosanto camp people. Last time I checked, the Academy was pretty down with the concept. Of course you have the inside track...

    So you started to train when you were, what, 3?

    And since you've trained and applied stuff, mind mentioning were?

    Hmm, the poit I'm raising is that every FMA instructor and Master that I've met, read or interacted with has said the same thing about disarms... in fact I'm pretty sure that even Guro Inosanto commented on their difficult outside of flow drills (and the fact that they're in there to help train flow first and foremost)... but heck, I've just done seminars with him, so I'm not in on the "inside stuff."

    I'm sure that this will eventually end up with your stories about fending off multiple attackers and streetfights.

    Let me be clear, I'm not discounting the mental role in martial arts. Or the psychology of the confrontation. I believe heavily in both and comment on them quite often. What I inherently distrust is anyone who says that the key to making "X" optimal technique work is mental attitude. My belief system has been formed through applied research, resistance training and heavy testing.

    What I know is that what most of the posters on this board have stated has matched my personal research in that field. What you are saying doesn't.

    - Matt
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2006
  15. Scotty Dog

    Scotty Dog www.myspace.com/elhig

    Beltless thanks for updateing your profile :cool:

    The issue here is that you've came to a thread about a testing ground for weapons arts, given no indication of your background & experiance (other than Hop scotch) started spouting about self defence and insulted some of the best and most respected stick fighters in the US.

    To say that they don't appear to have any real idea of fighting & to state that they have claimed to have all the answers & are unwilling to learn or review what they already know makes no sence.

    The people you are talking about have logged more hours with Guro inosanto that you ever could, They have or still do also train privately with Grand Tuhon Leo Gaje, Punong Guro Edgar Sulite, The Sayocs, Pendekar Paul de Thouars, Dr Gyi, The Machados, Gabe Suarez and at the Buddhai Swan Institute.

    to top this off, they don't rely on who they've trained with, but test what they know. Not just once, but constantly as they grow in their art. Not only that but they encourage others to test what they learn as well, rather that telling them "this is how it's done".

    Untill you've logged as much time testing what you say, you'll understand that people might not respect your opinion as much.

    I'm hosting Lonely Dog in Glasgow in November. If you doubt the skill that these guys have, come & train with him. I'll even waive the seminar fee. This isn't a macho challenge, it's an honest invitation for you to come & see for yourself. If you still disagree, then try & change our minds. Again, not a testosterone fulled challenge, more an open request to learn more.

    PM me if your interested, if not then I wouldn't say that other people are closed minded about their training.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2006
  16. Matt_Bernius

    Matt_Bernius a student and a teacher

    This is why ElHig rocks the party. Seriously, Beltless, many of us would give body parts for this type of opportunity. Espeically with a waved seminar fee and a great excuse to visit Glasgow. If you can, take Hig up on the offer!

    - Matt
     
  17. Ad McG

    Ad McG Troll-killer Supporter

    Tenner says he doesn't go...
     
  18. Cannibal Bob

    Cannibal Bob Non Timetis Messor

    I wish I could go. :cry:
     
  19. medi

    medi Sadly Passed Away - RIP


    No, you're expected to waffle a bit more, make some baseless accusations and unsubstantiated claims, then disappear back under your bridge.
     
  20. Sgt_Major

    Sgt_Major Ex Global Mod Supporter


    Same here!

    (Thread split to FMA)
     

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