First kickboxing class - a little annoyed

After many years of 'traditional' martial arts, I decided I'd give kickboxing a go to improve my fitness and punching skills. I found a large gym that is really conveniently located for me and has a reasonable stable of fighters (the first advice I got from a kickboxing friend was: even though I'm just going for fitness, find somewhere that also trains fighters, or it is likely to be a bit sub-standard) with a credible instructor who I'd heard of.

I work in the martial arts industry, so I'm fairly aware of all the shonky people and deal out there, but at the same time, I wanted to keep an open mind. The first red flag for me was that their website didn't specify prices - just 'come in for a trial class for only $10 (which really isn't that cheap, most clubs I've ever trained with have offered a free trial, but it wasn't a huge deal to me) and one of our 'consultants' will speak to you about prices'. I pretty much knew this meant they would at least try and sell me on a range of 'packages', which always annoys me a bit. The second red flag was when I went in to organise the trial, and the girl behind the counter told me that she had no idea what the prices were, but the guy standing right next to me would speak to me about it AFTER the trial class this evening.

So I came in for the class and really enjoyed it. It was a good workout and everyone was quite friendly.

But as soon as the class was over, they whisked me over to a lounge area to discuss payment options. They said you could either pay $20 a class as you go plus $95 insurance (clearly just a dummy option, as no one would pay rates like that) OR $25 a week for unlimited classes, no insurance and '$300' worth of gear. It sounds like a pretty good deal, but the catch was that you had to sign up for 10 months. I know better than to sign up on the spot to anything, so I said I'd like to go home and think about it. To which I was told if I did, the less of the free gear I could get. I have access to pretty cheap equipment, so that really didn't faze me, but annoyed me as a pressure tactic to get people to sign up on the spot, when you're tired after a class and the endorphins are still running high. The guy was very, very keen to get a day he could call me next week so I could let him know what my decision was.

Anyway, I wasn't 100% against it when I left, but on the train home, the more I thought about it, the more I realised what a ****** deal it was. $25 a week isn't a lot IF you're training several times a week, but it is a lot to pay if, for whatever reason, you can't train. 10 months is a long time - what if I get sick? Or if I change jobs and can't train any more? Or when I go on holidays? They'll still be taking the money out of my account every week.

Additionally, sports insurance doesn't cost $95 a year. For a big club like that, it's maybe $50 a student, if that. Which means they're just pocketing the difference. Also, even at retail prices, gloves, shorts, a singlet and a skipping rope is no way worth $300 (and I wouldn't be 'saving' money on all those things, because the only thing I would actually buy for myself are gloves).

I know there are plenty of dodgier deals out there, but it has still left a pretty bad taste in my mouth. I don't like being worked over by a 'sales consultant' or being pressured into paying money. All I really want is a decent gym where I can pay as I go.

Now I've had some time to relax, I'm not even sure the class was THAT good. I really enjoyed it at the time, but it was huge (at least 30 people) and while I, as the new student, got to work with the trainer for a while, everyone else just trained with each other for the whole class (which was just a warm-up and pad work). No one was there to help them with their technique. I worked with one girl who was terrible, but no one would have known or shown her how to do it better. I could see this getting a bit frustrating. If there's no one to help me become a better at the techniques, it's really just a cardio kickboxing class that I could do at a commercial gym.

Is this a typical kickboxing class? Can you guys suggest any other 'tell-tale' signs of a dodgy gym?

 

Sounds like a McDojo, avoid it. Have a look at what else is in the area.

 

i'd avoid it... sounds like a mickey mouse school

 

I just don't get the whole insurance thing. I've never ever payed for insurance or been to a gym that offered it. To me it sounds entirely dumb to be paying for insurance to go to the gym. That in itself sounds like some sort of chain gym option or some such rubbish.

Just curious how many of you out there pay for some sort of insurance to cover your martial arts practice specifically. Could you also state what country and what MA your doing.

 

All Uk Martial Arts clubs/Schools require personal insurance/license

 

Really? So is that cost directly passed on to the student? ?

Are you given the option for paying more with insurance or less without it somehow?

 

Instructors need to have professional indemnity.
students must have their own personal indemnity.
the students indemnity is only valid within a sanctioned event i.e class, competition, testing,

 

Really??!
*draw hits the floor!!
So you must have personal insurance before you can train in martial arts?!
That seems entirely absurd!!!

 

Absurd it may be but its a legal requirement has been since before i took up martial arts. Now with the no win no fee lawyers deals theres always someone looking for a reason to sue. this insurance is there to protect all parties from theese sue at the drop of a hat types. Not defending it just stating why it is.

 

usually the insurance comes from whatever organisation your affiliated with when you pay for membership to them, for example I pay the BJA about 30 quid a year and for that I get to attend their gradings and I get my insurance for the year.

 

Yeah, I've always had to pay for insurance before, but it's never been anywhere near $95. Usually it was about $25-$50 a year. The instructor usually organises through a sports insurance place and you pay them. Some places will call this 'annual club fees' or the like, but at the end of the day, it's about covering people's arses when someone gets injured.

For me, it's not that $95 is an outrageous amount of money (though I don't have a huge disposable income), but more knowing they're probably lying and pocketing part of it (and I'll admit I COULD be wrong, but it seems a lot).

 

Can i add AIMAA membership & Insurance comes in at £25 per year

 

No wonder my Sifu was worried when my nose got broken

 

Yes, I should add that in my previous experience, the insurance was bundled with membership of a larger organisation that also offered other benefits. This fee is just straight out money to the company.

 

To be fair anyone ive trained with has always accepted knocks and injuries as just part of the training. But the British Taekwon-Do Concill pay out on about 30+ claims per year if memory serves correctly

 

Usually you would get a licence book with insurance slip in there,the book may contain a page for promotions passed,competition record,courses attended etc,different Uk associations charge different prices,im unsure of the UK average but would guess at £30.00 per annum.

The class sounds a bit more like a kickboxercise style workout than kickboxing,which of course is good for fitness and fun,
make sure you know what your goals are when you start training and that they are going to be met at that particular club,
perhaps speak with the main instructor and tell him what it is you would like to develop.

Sounds like your emotions were running high on the train home so take a bit of time to reflect before commiting yourself to the gym and the contract

 

Well, the gym does have a decent stable of fighters, so I presumed going in that it wasn't going to be boxercise-esque. This was a "beginners" class, so maybe not all their classes are just pad work, but maybe only the fighter training classes focus on proper sparring techniques. Nevertheless, I'd have though that a beginner class would focus MORE on technique, not less.

A brief run-down of what we did in the hour: started with skipping and stretching, then went straight into pad work with a partner - doing punch combos and then some kicking. In between each set, we did push-ups or sit-ups or similar. Then there was a brief warm down.

I don't really want to be a competitive fighter, but I do want to learn the techniques as well as if I was. I'd certainly consider some amateur comps with a bit of padding at some point. I can already kick pretty well, but my punches, elbows and knees could certainly do with some work. To me, there's no point in training it unless I'm learning how to do it better, not just more efficiently because my fitness improves.

Anyway, it's a moot point, because I doubt I'll go back - I don't really want anything to do with a club that employs 'sales consultants'.

There's another gym that's not quite as close, but with what I have learnt, looks a lot better. It's a quite traditional Thai gym (though I believe there is no expectation to fight) that seems less commercially-focused.

 

OK I Am an X (PLEASE NOTE THE WORD X) ATA instructor and the school your describing sounds alot like that with the whole Range of packages scheme and the desk worker not knowing prices and things like that so my advice is this Are you ready hope so you need to........................ RUN LIKE BLOODY HELL!!!!!!

 

My instructor really focuses on technique. We can go a bit sloppy when we're doing conditioning drills cos that's just about speed and stamina, but when we're doing any bag work or "sparring" drills he's often stopping people and correcting things, even on the more experienced members. Stuff like rolling your shoulder for elbow strikes, closing the distance correctly y'know. If they're not concerned with techniques sounds like a bit of a waste to me...

 

Honestly I've never had to pay insurance that wasn't included in the school's membership.

My dojo charges $50 per month, $75 in you want to do our once a week kenshu class and this includes insurance and we only pay a yearly membership fee of $25 at the time we signed up.

We give our sensei post dated cheques for the whole year and if we're injured for a month or two and ask him he gives us our cheques back for those months (though most people don't ask because we love our sensei and want to support our dojo).

Honestly that gym sound like a waste of your time. They obviously use pressure tactics and try to manipulate people with package deals, while apparently providing little technical help in their huge class sizes.

Look elsewhere my friend. Find somewhere with a great instructor who helps his students. Reasonable prices and class sizes and that isn't trying to rip you off.