Does My Teacher Sound Like A Fraud?

First off, I thank everyone here on this forum. Many of you have always been insightful, and it is wonderful to have such a tremendous amount of support from martial artists.

My question is: is my martial arts teacher a fraud? As a person who wants to instruct other in the martial arts one day, I'm worried about what he is teaching me. It's clearly not in other schools. I'm asking this, because the last time I was in class, he added something to the Tai Chi form (which I have been practicing diligently for 3 years) that he has never shown me. To top it off, many of the current students who help the lower level students are teaching things that are completely off with what I was taught by him - and he's taking their side

I've done my research, ranging from him, to the styles he teaches, to the affiliations he is associated with. As far as his 9th (or 10th?) Degree Black Belt in Moo Duk Kwan TKD, it's from an association he either founded or co-founded, or currently is the owner. The TKD forms look like bastadized versions of Shotokan/Moo Duk Kwan. The Tai Chi form he is teaching is a VERY off-shoot form of Cheng Man-Ching's form - I have never been able to find anyone else who does it. The Tai Chi certification is not from the same association as his TKD certificates, but I could never find the origin of that association. It's also fairly old (from the late 80s or early 90s). They could very well be long gone.

POSITIVE NOTES - he can demonstrate mystical Chi techniques (???). When I really pick his brain about something, he actually gives me an answer that is both enlightening and helpful in every way. He can actually apply techniques in real life situations, and he has shown it dozens of times with many of the would-be students who come in and try to expose him as a fake. Currently, he is training with a Bagua instructor who he completely reveres, and the Bagua instructor (who seems legit?) has an enormous amount of respect for him.

 

Well, it seems that he is a perfectly competent teacher who has had his techniques pressure tested. Uhh, in terms of student teachers ... are they all teaching different stuff, or are they in a sense "flawed but united," which is they are teaching the same thing, but it is different from what the instructor taught. If that is the case (flawed by united), possibly at a given level, there is a certain degree of interpretation that the instructor allows.

I'm not very sure, but if he does turn out to be fraudulent, atleast he is competent enough to apply what he teaches to a real life scenario.

 

Hi nefariusmdk. Nice to see you posting. The fact that you show concern and have been researching and thinking of this, also show a good degtree of intellect

Just because somthing may not be in other schools, does not mean that your instructor may not have studied it, but decided to change some things.

Perhaps, he added things for a change, and expects you and other senior students to adapt.

This raises a red flag. I am not too found of people "created their own association" which often to leads to "self-appointed rank". On a rare case, if the person had spent "several years" in a partiicular martial art(s), then decided to create a art or association is ok, but the ranking still comes of as egocentric.

Well, you sort of answered or have a conclusion. Because the forms appear to be bastadized versions of Shotokan/Moo Duk Kwan, you will not find anyone else who does it.

Not so odd if such a association did not exist to begin with. I become weary of certifications (learning from bitter expereinces myself) which seem to not have a good lineage. Also, certfications and rank does not equate to skill or good teaching ability

But how do you know if what he is giving you to be correct? You already have suspections that he maybe a fraud.

These techniques, did they appear before or after his study of Bagua?

Here is another thought to ponder;
If your instructor is still going forth to study other things (like Bagua), perhaps you should also.

There is no disgrace for moving on.

I had a few times after years with someone.

If your teacher, like some of those I had, is very sincere about your study and progress, he will suggest which other arts you should look into

Take care

 

Thank you all for the replies. To answer some questions: yes he's practiced these chi demos long before he started bagua. As for the level of "interpretation" I understand what you mean. I've been watching several different applications videos, and the form techniques can be used in a variety of ways. I keep hearing that there is no right or wrong way when interpreting the moves, but the foundation of being like water is the key.

I do not mean any disrespect towards him. I have the utmost respect for him and his skill. However, without a sense of clarity of what I've been taught, I'm not sure how to help the newer students - I'm not even sure if I'm qualified, but my master wants me to rise to the occasion.

 

Yes, your teacher is a fraud.

 

Can you tell us more about this? Specifics? Videos?

How do you know the bagua teacher is legit? If your teacher WAS a fraud (I am not saying that he is), they often use such things as cross associating with other frauds to give the appearance of credibility to each other.

What style of bagua is it also?

 

Judging from that girl's gi (dobok) in the video, she's definitely a Moo Duk Kwan (Tang Soo Do) practioner, and they do the forms with more softness than in Shotokan. Yeah I see a lot of the MDK/TSD people perform forms like that :/

Anyway, the Bagua teacher came from a recommendation from one of his students, who was also training under my master. He came to expose my teacher as a fraud, but after working with him, talking with him, and training with him, he had the utmost respect for him, and my teacher was impressed with his training too. My teacher asked to be taken under him, and so it worked out.

 

That sounds a bit like saying that he can levitate, or make himself invisible!

How does he demonstrate these things? I'm curious, because I don't believe that such things exist, except in the minds of the gullible or in the mouths of charlatans. You don't sound gullible, and I'm not going to label your teacher a charlatan without knowing much about him. But as soon as I see the word 'mystical', I cringe.

 

Except for the magic powers (master chi techniques?) he seems fine. Lots of good teachers (especially at advanced levels) make tweaks to their styles to better suit their experiences.

And I wouldn't worry about not being able to find the association who gave out his tai chi rank. The karate dojo I got my black belt in split from the greater shidokan association to get away from politics,something similar could be at play.

 

Thank you for mentioning this!! One thing I can definitely say is that the school and other teachers are politics free. The last school I went to was filled with favoritism, politics, and all sorts of internal problems - it was basically why I never got my black belt in my old WTF TKD school.

Sorry for mentioning the chi demos as "mystical". But my teacher frequently demonstrates how powerful chi can be. Nothing extreme like taking a bat or a knife to the abdomen like those shaolin monks on TV, but he has demonstrated chi with uprooting, rooting, and showing how powerful chi can be when applying Tai Chi in combat. I personally believe in chi and chakras, and don't find it hokey one bit.

 

What he has shown you is the real meaning of 'chi', which is fundamentally good body mechanics and using your body and your energy in the most efficient and effective way that you can. All the 'mystical energy' stuff is just hokum, and it does Taiji a disservice because it tries to explain the comprehensible in terms of the incomprehensible.

 

Johnno you explained it perfectly!! This is why the posture and poses in Tai Chi are so relevant to us internally and in applications, down to the twisting of your hands and the weight on your feet. I need to internalize your answer.

 

I don't know anything about the art you are doing, but my teachers in CHKD would often show me something in one way and then show another in another way. Arts tend to evolve a bit sometimes... or some teachers just do not like certain things and after trying it many many times, they decide to make a different variation of a particular move. No system is perfect of course.

I can feel your pain, as your teacher may have the very best intentions, but ultimately may or may not be going about his instruction the correct way. Teaching MA's to me is like teaching someone Math or anything else. My sister teaches everything from simple Math to AP Calculus, Trigonometry, etc etc and I go over to her house when she has some tutoring sessions and she many times doesn't teach 2 different people the same way to get the answers. Remember our brains and bodies all work differently. A teacher that doesn't get frustrated and can adapt to each person IMO is a good teacher if the end result of each student ultimately comes out to have the same result.

 

On a side note, have you ever thought about a more simple art that doesn't use any sort of belt system? Not to take the place of what you are doing now, but just for the sake of giving it a shot. Boxing? Muay Thai, Kickboxing, JKD? I think belts add pressure and are just a reward thing for many of us. I'd rather just have my instructor say "hey, you're really picking it up well, good job today".

 

This happens a bit in Kajukenbo, different parts of the style are emphasized depending on the necessity in the area. Especially for our purposes, we want to adapt to what is happening in "street" situations, and as such must tweak things to move with the times. I've seen in tournaments that Kajukenbo schools of the same branch and method, Ex: Chuan Fa: Gaylord's Method, have katas (pinyans, forms, what have you, pretty much the same thing) that are slightly different. They keep the essence, but the how it is expressed is occasionally different. (Just inputting to help emphasize that variety isn't always a bad thing, he might just be going on with the times)

 

Yes, I understand where you're coming from there. With now doing kickboxing only my teacher will show me sometimes multiple ways of strikes, or just something that we happen to be working on and then will tell me that he prefers one over the other, but either is ok, it's just a matter of preference... not to mention that physically sometimes some guys/girls are just not able to move a certain way, they don't have as much natural ability of speed or power, etc. When I was doing the Combat Hapkido, they liked that I was flexible enough that certain moves just didn't work on me at all, or not enough that I couldn't get out of it or have to tap, so we would make just small variations in some moves as an in case we happened to need to use something on one who was very flexible like myself.