Defence against faster opponent

Discussion in 'Kickboxing' started by nimpy, Apr 2, 2015.

  1. nimpy

    nimpy Valued Member

    Hi All

    Last night at training we did a a drill which involved not being able to move away and just punches to the head/body.

    I came up against one lad that I just couldn't defend against, he is a few grades higher than me but I still felt annoyed at my lack of ability against him.

    His punches were quick and hard, and I seemed unable to stop him, basically getting punched stupid, to the point where I didn't feel that I learned anything from the experience. The only consolation was that I landed a nice hook to his gut which stopped him in his tracks, but that was more luck than judgement if I am honest.

    Should I just of covered up and hoped or was I right in trying to hit back ?
    any advice welcome.
     
  2. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Staying in the pocket is something I struggle with as well. I would say check your range, hands up, and head movement. I'd also say as a general rule of thumb for countering, kick them when they punch, and punch them when they kick.

    Pad work drills were the pad holder is hitting back is also good :)
     
  3. fatcat

    fatcat Valued Member

    I had the same problem a few weeks ago. We were tied together with belts and I was constantly in range getting clobbered. I eventually called a time-out because I couldn't take anymore.
    Afterwards, thinking about it I thought that it was a sort of realistic scenario were I am losing and what that feels like for me i.e. could I carry on taking it waiting for the end to come or not.
     
  4. PointyShinyBurn

    PointyShinyBurn Valued Member

    Do this thing:
    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4Kqx2kdjIY[/ame]
     
  5. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    Pick a fast training partner if you can?
     
  6. HarryF

    HarryF Malued Vember

    It's not you, it's him...

    In my view, there is a significant difference between training your skills and testing your skills. I think of the former as things like learning a new technique, using that technique in a drill, and playing (light) sparring games to try to use your new technique; I think of the latter as things like heavy sparring or a full fight/full contact scenario.

    When it comes to a drill like the one you describe, if my students were doing it, I'd try make sure that the guy being punched was able to cover/defend and hit back with at least an 80% success rate. Much less success than this and, as you said, the defender isn't learning very much as they're being overwhelmed.

    The opposite is also true that, if the defender is 100% successfull, the attacker isn't really applying enough enthusiasm for the defender to be challenged, and the defender is simply going through the motions (again, not learning very much beyond the basic technique, but basic technique should have been covered by now if you're doing this type of drill).

    It can be a bit tricky to get the balance right, especially if you're with a training partner you don't know that well, or someone with that attitude (we all know the type ;)). If you find yourself in a similar situation in the future, you could try suggesting that they just ease up a touch but not too much, so you're challenged but not overwhelmed!

    Of course, if your instructor meant the drill to be a test (of willpower/fighting spirit etc), then do what you can and try to learn from it afterwards.

    I hope this helps and good luck next time :)
     
  7. nimpy

    nimpy Valued Member

    Thanks for the replies, PointyShinyburn that drill look good.

    Chadderz it was hands only, but I definately need to work on moving my head more and my blocking just wasn't fast enough.

    HarryF, I think you hit the nail on the head Thanks ! :)
     
  8. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    If you are blocking you are already playing "catch up" - try counterpunching and evasion instead; much more efficient and successful
     
  9. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    Reaction is slower than action. Spirit to be brave. Followed by the mind. And then the body. Your blocks or covers should be strikes. For instance, using your forearms/elbows, you should be trying to get your opponent to break their hand on your elbow. This is faster because your mind is taking action rather than reacting. This does not mean to overreach though, you want to do the minimum movement necessary and maintain maximum mobility.

    To slow done the Opponent you must try to make them reacquire targeting continuously. Is one way to cause the opponent to have to reacquire target. There are other methods to make the body hard to hit target all involving good footwork.

    Or to take the striking step forward with your counter punch because if you don't and lose probably half your power. Having good footwork.
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2015
  10. YouKnowWho

    YouKnowWho Valued Member

    IMO, the regular "covered up" is too conservative because your hands are too close to yourself and too far away from your opponent. Your "covered up" won't give your opponent any threaten at all. You can use "rhino guard" as your "covered up" and put your hands as close to your opponent's face as possible.

    [​IMG]

    This will serve the following purpose.

    - You can run toward your opponent like a mad man, use your "rhino guard" to deflect his punches, smash your "big fist" onto his face, and put him in defense mode.
    - Hide your head behind your "rhino guard" so your opponent will have hard time to hit your head.
    - Force your opponent to punch from both sides of your arms. Seal your "front door" completely.
    - Don't give your opponent enough space to generate his powerful and fast punches.
    - Stop your opponent's punch in the initial stage.
    - Try to fight in your opponent's territory instead of try to fight in your own territory.
    - It's easily to get into a clinch if needed from that position.
    - ...

    Here are 2 examples.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrSyGFS4IkI"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrSyGFS4IkI[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoobpbgSrNk"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoobpbgSrNk[/ame]
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2015
  11. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    I think this is a terrible defence and a stupid idea.

    In this video we have an attacker throwing weak punches in straight lines towards the hands that are protecting the face.

    Try the same against a mobile attacker, punching on both high and low lines and at angles and it'll fall flat.
     
  12. Kave

    Kave Lunatic

    Not only that, that guard would leave you with extremely limited counter-attack options. Your opponent would just walk in on you and keep throwing. You would be eating hooks all day, and be unable to respond.
     
  13. YouKnowWho

    YouKnowWho Valued Member

    Since the nature of the "rhino guard" is both of your hands are very close to your opponent's head. Even if he punches high, his head will be exposed. If he punches low, his head will be exposed even more. No matter how your opponent may punch, he will expose his head. That's what you are looking for.

    When your opponent is

    - on guard, his head is protected.
    - punching at your head, his head is exposed.

    When Your opponent is trying to punch at your head, you are trying to wrap his head the moment that his head is exposed.

    You may deflect no more than 2 of your opponent's punches. The moment that he punches, the moment that you deflect his right punch to your left, deflect his left punch to your right. You then move in between his both arms and you are not going to wait for his 3rd punch. That's your "strategy".

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eSg-vCAtHc&feature=youtu.be"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eSg-vCAtHc&feature=youtu.be[/ame]
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2015
  14. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    I didn't even have to look at the video. Thanks for saving me Simon.

    Covering up is not supposed to be a static position unless you are accepting that you will be pounded on and you are just trying to mitigate the damage. My instructor got caught once with six people attacking him. He was up against a wall and used an active cover while they punched him. After a while they let him leave. He knew not to fight back because they had guns and knives. That was his decision and he survived it.

    Covering up in the ring is not supposed to be static. You need to use your footwork. The most basic is to back pedal and cover up and use head movement. Lateral movement is next level.

    I just like to strike them in the solar plexus with my shoulder like a battering ram. However, someone else might prefer to head butt.

    The point is MOVE YOUR FEET when covering up in the ring.
     
  15. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    How does this help in kickboxing?

    Before going into clinching, probably better to learn how to use footwork.
     
  16. Kave

    Kave Lunatic

    No. This is silly. Arms are not easy to catch when you are up against a competent striker throwing punches in bunches. This sort of advice could get someone hurt. If you are including grappling, then you are in an even worse position, because "SURPRISE" your opponent can grapple too, and the first basic rule of grappling is "never leave your arms out for people to grab".
     
  17. Kave

    Kave Lunatic

    You are absolutely right in trying to hit back, covering up just allows your opponent to keep striking without having to worry about their own safety. You will never be able to block everything if you continue to cover up, and will eventually become a punching bag.

    When I am getting punches raining down on me I like to really tighten up my guard, then wait for a shot on my guard so I can chase it back. What that means is if my opponent hits me with a left hook, the second I feel that contact on my right guard I will throw a straight or o/h right back at them. Same goes for if they are throwing a right, I will try to chase their shot back with my left.
     
  18. nimpy

    nimpy Valued Member

    Thanks for all the advice People :)

    Got a Tournament on Saturday, so hope to be able to put it into practice :)
     
  19. HarryF

    HarryF Malued Vember

    I hope your tournament is fun - let us know how it goes!
     
  20. nimpy

    nimpy Valued Member

    Hi

    Well, it all came together pretty much, and I managed to get the Bronze in the over 92kg Continuous category I have some vids I can post later, although I lost in semi contact. All in all pretty pleased, felt like huge leap forward since my last tournament on November
    :)
     

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