Could FMA have some Spanish influence?

Discussion in 'Filipino Martial Arts' started by katame-waza, Apr 6, 2006.

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  1. Mananandata

    Mananandata Valued Member

    Do you know anyone in KI? If you do, then you know that there is only one person who shares your passion with this Spanish influence/connection. Almost all of the seniors and direct students of the old man uses Kali to represent their brand of KI. No one has that rabid anti-Kali that you try to stamp on KI group as a whole.
    GM Norman Suanico uses Kali. GM Chris Ricketts uses Kali. GM Sulite and his students use Kali. M Galang uses Kali. M Robert Morales uses Kali. M Raganas uses Kali. Students of GM Tony Diego who formed their own groups also use Kali without any problem with the grandmaster. The Great Grand Master Antonio Ilustrisimo himself signed documents certifying instructors of Kali Ilustrisimo Escrima!
    It's just you, Macapagal and Yuli Romo that speak of Kali in disparaging way. Which of the two do you represent then? Obviously, a nameless guy like you can't speak for KI.
  2. onpoint

    onpoint Valued Member

    I am not speaking for KI, I am giving credit to them.

    I absolutely understand that people use Escrima, Arnis & Kali interchangeably w/out pause or thought. Look at Doce Pares' t-shirts claiming all 3 words--no one wants to get left out of "the blade arts" hustle.

    The point is that Tatang Ilustrisimo didn't use Kali, nor others from Bantayan, Cebu.

    For many, Kali came later, and for you it was exactly 3 years ago, here.

    The search is for the historicity of the word Kali, not when and where, or if people prefer to use of the word Kali per se. We are searching for the authentic use of this word.

    Remember it's not about some simple word preference, because of some made up offense 4 generations ago by the Spaniards.

    Most people I know use Kali, Arnis, FMA & Escrima interchangeably, especially Pinoys talking to foreigners.

    It's not about rabid this or rabid that, it's about being able to back your claims,

    so far thanks to KI publications, online commentaries, etc. the Spanish connection has continued to display historical merits, more so than the pure, unadulterated Kali propaganda.

    That's the point, for all that, KI must be given credit here.

    At the end of the day, there was a choice to go with Kali or Kalis, why the latter was chosen for KI, kinda ends all this word preference side-discussion.;)
  3. Pat OMalley

    Pat OMalley Valued Member

    as a point of interest I knew Robert Morales for quite some time since 92 in fact and actually he used the Term Olistrisimo I still have the business card he gave my wife in 2006 as she sat sharing beers till 5 in the morning on the balcony of the hotel watching the sun go down and up again over Manila Bay.

    Like it's being said it's not who uses the term now or in the recent past it's actually the history behind the term that is seriously brought into question and the denial from certain parties with regards to Spanish influence in the FMA.
  4. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    Apparently, I didn't make myself very clear. Tone it down please. Enough bickering.
  5. Mananandata

    Mananandata Valued Member

    In fact, he registered the name Kali Olistrisimo Eskrima. We collected the money to pay for the registration. Until the time of his death, he was working on a thesis about Kali. He was the staunchest advocate of the term Kali among KI. For a short time, I solicited money and acted as treasurer for his group. He asked me to design and make swords for him. He asked me to teach his son. Interesting eh?
    He once told me a story about a drunken guy crawling under the table. Sounds familiar?

    Like I said, don't drag KI in this pseudo history, anti-Kali and anti-gaje campaign. Leave KI out of it. You can discuss all o these ad nauseam til kingdom come and you won't hear from any of us.
  6. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    This is a final warning, Mananandata. Stop the axe grinding or take a break from posting (whether you want one or not). Your call.
  7. onpoint

    onpoint Valued Member

    Why Kali has so many SECRETS

    You've already mentioned Mr. Morales' "research" 3 years ago, arguing with me:

    Either the fruits of this "research" are SECRET (as in everything with Kali) or nothing of note came out of it :rolleyes:.

    The registration of the name Kali Olistrisimo Eskrima is as significant to the Kali cause as Doce Pares' assumption of Arnis, Escrima & Kali in its merchandizing.

    Just as you've assumed the word Kali out of thin air 3 years ago, because of some perceived offense more than a century ago by the Spanish, Mr. Morales' use of the word is not only revisionist, pseudo-history, it's an affront to Tatang's art--what's wrong with the words he used?
  8. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    And scene.
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