Chipshop...

Discussion in 'Off Topic Area' started by Mr Punch, Jun 5, 2007.

  1. Topher

    Topher allo!

    Not always as sometime they live in their own specific area, away from everyone else, but when it is somewhat mixed, it appears to be like a Catch-22. The ‘host community’ feels threatened by people of different origins arriving in their community, or even making it their ‘base’, speaking their own language, and the community changes as a result. This is perceived as them integrating or acknowledging to the wider cultural community. The longer this happens, the greater the difference and segregation. This affects the community, often to a degree where white people feel like they have to move.

    Part of this is ignorance on both sides, likely due to the fact that it has been taboo to discuss many issues socially and politically, so they haven’t. This creates ignorance.

    An recent episode of BBC Panorama explored this issue. In the episodes, they fitted a tracking device to an asian cab driver, and a white cab driver and tracked their location throughout the day. Both unconsciously stayed within to their own areas.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/panorama/6631541.stm

    ”The problem that Panorama observes cannot be simply dismissed as "racism", although there will be racists, inevitably, on both sides.

    What differentiates the communities is not just skin colour but a more complex combination of race, religion, and language and culture, and these factors added together are a recipe for social separation.”


    It’s even worse for older people, who probably react more inflexible to such change, on both sides
     
  2. Hiroji

    Hiroji laugh often, love much

    There are many factors why many first and second generation immigrants live within separate communities.

    The first area to look at is why they came over? Many came to work in the mill town areas of northern England, hence the reason they all lived together in the same areas.

    Which by its nature wasn’t going to help with the multicultural idea.
     
  3. Topher

    Topher allo!

    No. We are not encouraging people to segregate directly, but in highlighting each culture, specifically the differences, it draws attention to the differences between people and in turn makes it harder to integrate. We should focus on the similarities, while at the same time hold projecting anything from criticism and discussion. At the moment it seems to create a society where the minority culture can express itself, with criticism, disproval or debate about it being taboo. Meanwhile the majority culture has to be careful not to ‘offend’ the minorities, such as by adapting for the minority culture! Part of this has led to the fact any talk of Islam that isn’t positive is likely to be labelled ‘Islamaphobia’, and as such, it becomes sheltered from discussion, which in turn creates separation.

    The language issue is a good example:
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6174303.stm
    “Speaking through a translator, a Bangladeshi woman who has lived in the UK for 22 years and does not speak English questioned this spending.

    She said: "When you are trying to help us you are actually harming. Even before we ask, all we have to do is say hello, they are here with their interpreters. We just sit here doing nothing and we don't need to speak in English at all."


    Of course, people will and should have their own cultural. No one is asking them to abandon it, but were are certain cultural elements which form the wider culture of this country.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiculturalism#United_Kingdom_2
    In November 2006, Prime Minister Tony Blair stated that Britain has certain "essential values" and that these are a "duty". He did not reject multiculturalism as such, but he included British heritage among the essential values:[25]
    "When it comes to our essential values - belief in democracy, the rule of law, tolerance, equal treatment for all, respect for this country and its shared heritage - then that is where we come together, it is what we hold in common."

    All that aside, I used to work for my local council so I've had some first hand experience.
     
  4. Johnno

    Johnno Valued Member

  5. Johnno

    Johnno Valued Member

    I saw that program, and it was one of the things I was thinking of when I posted!

    It was striking how some of the Asian residents of Blackburn wanted to move out of their 'own' areas, but were made to feel distinctly unwelcome if they moved to a predominantly white area.
     
  6. SiAiS

    SiAiS Moved on

    I like Chapeltown, it reminds me of Wimbeldon, my auntie used to live there
     
  7. Hiroji

    Hiroji laugh often, love much

    Chapeltown is predominantly afro Caribbean... ;)

    Did you read the link?

    Because chapeltown is included within the UKs ghettos.
     
  8. Johnno

    Johnno Valued Member

    Is it heck! It's quite possible that the largest single ethnic group might be those of West Indian origin, but it certainly isn't the majority.

    I didn't give the link on Chappie more than a quick look, because I know the area pretty well, so I trust my own knowledge more than Wikipedia. ;)

    By who? :confused:
     
  9. Hiroji

    Hiroji laugh often, love much

    You accuse me of not reading them and you haven’t read them yourself! :p

    Ok then, id say chapeltown is a socially deprived area consisting mostly of ethnic groups. Gun crime, gangs and drugs are a problem... :p :D
     
  10. Topher

    Topher allo!

    Due to the fact that diffrences between the diffrent cultures makes it diffucult for many to integrate.

    Asian people feel like they can't go into non-Asian areas, while white people feel like they are being forced out of theirs.
     
  11. Topher

    Topher allo!

    The problem doesn't just have to be them living in seperate communities.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/panorama/6631541.stm
    "Anyone who goes to Blackburn's town centre, and takes a look around, will see that whites and Muslim Asians are sharing the shopping centre and that everyone is behaving perfectly courteously to each other.

    So what's the problem? Well, look a bit more carefully, and you'll see that they are both here doing their shopping - but they're not shopping together.

    They're nearly always shopping separately. And that's the typical pattern here.

    Defined areas

    There's very little casual, social association between whites and Muslim Asians. There's an obvious geographical separation."


    The problem is more than geographical.
     
  12. Johnno

    Johnno Valued Member

    I just thought it was funny you posting a link which undermined your own argument! ;) :D

    Yes, it's an area with a lot of ethnic minority communities - but then so is most of the city if you want to be picky about it. (And you are talking to Mr Picky. ;) ) And sure, it has a lot of social problems. But it still fails the 'Ghetto test', because it's a real melting pot.
     
  13. alister

    alister Huh?

    I'd like to take the "ghetto test"...I reckon I can pass wiv like 85%, den I can bust a cap in yo ass 'cos den I will be like well street innit?
     

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