Chi demonstration videos...

Discussion in 'Tai chi' started by ZillaBilla, Jun 23, 2004.

  1. Mad Yakker

    Mad Yakker Valued Member

    Anyone want to visit VC, to test it out?!

     
  2. NRees

    NRees Taekwon-Do II Degree

    I think the first video can be put down to really bad breath....
     
  3. jokerlaughsatu

    jokerlaughsatu New Member

    all i can do is laugh
     
  4. ckfnpku

    ckfnpku Valued Member

  5. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

    Guy certainly knows how to take a dive :rolleyes:
     
  6. RobP

    RobP Valued Member

    "Anyone want to visit VC, to test it out?!"

    I trained with VC a few years back, I wouldn't dismiss him on the look of a few dodgy looking clips.

    cheers
     
  7. Mad Yakker

    Mad Yakker Valued Member

    Let's find out the truth..

     
  8. Taliar

    Taliar Train harder!

    I can knock people out without touching them. Once i was chatting to this guy about the finer points of the OSI 7 layer model and all of a sudden he fell over. Now my nasty mates say it was cos I am boring but I don't believe them its the power of my CHHIIIIIIII!!!!!!
     
  9. tccstudent

    tccstudent Valued Member

    Yes, why don't you find out the truth Yakker? Go on down and test your "tai chi" skill against him. It wouldn't be the first time someone challenged him (or his father), and I for one would sure like to see it!! I don't mean to come off aggresive, but I'm tired of all the TCC Internet warriors who spout off and seem to know what is good or bad tai chi by watching a 10 second video clip. That's all I had to say, you may now return to your regularly scheduled chatter.
     
  10. Shadowdh

    Shadowdh Seeker of Knowledge

    I can understand that you may be annoyed with some of the responses TCCStudent but you have to admit that when that sort of thing is bandied about it discredits the player quite a bit... I have heard alot of good things about VC but if I had seen that video looking for a teacher I would run a mile... it just isnt real...
     
  11. tccstudent

    tccstudent Valued Member

    Real? How do you know what is real and isn't real if you haven't felt it, or even understand it? Some people are more fascinated with the "feeling" of chi/energy than others. That video does not tell the whole story, believe me! You should see GSC push hands, because if you did, it may open your mind up to the process. I guess you could use the old addage that people mock, or are afraid, of what they don't understand. I know I was extremely skeptical at first! I don't mean to come off as any authority here (i'm just a lowly student), but one of the problems with TCC today is that most TCC schools don't even practice dynamic push hands, which is at the core of internal power training in the Yang system. To quote a student of GSC, "To understand the traditional Yang family Tai Chi Chuan, one must truly understand the principles of "Steel Wrapped in Cotton", "Borrowing Energy", "Stillness in Motion", etc. Moreover, the understanding of these principles is derived by the profound method of "DYNAMIC/POWER PUSHING HANDS." Without these principles, whatever he/she is doing CANNOT be the traditional Tai Chi Chuan. It is merely imitation, at best, & not the famous & powerful Tai Chi Chuan of Yang, Lu-Chan & his family."

    This process has been passed down from Yang Cheng Fu - Yang Sau Chung - GSC - VC and others. Most schools today don't even know what it is. Here is a small article by VC that sheds some more light on the subject of dynamic push hands and the training process to develop internal chin.....

    http://www.nytaichi.com/pushing.htm
     
  12. Shadowdh

    Shadowdh Seeker of Knowledge

    Dude... I can appreciate the concepts of steel wrapped in cotton, even understand borrowing energy as meant by turning anothers strength etc against them, stillness in motion etc... but those concepts are one thing its quite another and something that brings taiji into ridicule claiming that you can manipulate someone as if they were a puppet on the end of strings as in the video... then when the person allegedly under this "power" seems to be able to miraculously brush the hair from their eyes or manage to look back to make sure they dont hit anything when being repulsed... it just isnt real... its the kung fu movies with cables... next you will have me believe that they can step on bamboo poles and fly around buildings while fighting...

    I am pretty new to this as well and the main reason it took me soooo long to get into taiji was due the the mystic brigade... we practice push hands and I have felt true steel wrapped in cotton wool... it is incredible but by no means does it make me dance around like I have a hold of some high voltage cables...
     
  13. tccstudent

    tccstudent Valued Member

    First off, nobody is claiming anything. I think the problem here is that maybe some people might not understand what they are looking at. There are no false idols here, just different training methods. I believe what that video is showing you is more of a "cooperative exercise" relating to the "feeling it" of energy/chi. This is energy work and one of it's training methods. This I mentioned previously. There are multiple training exercises for these purposes but the operative word is "training." I also suspect there aren't too many practitioners using these methods, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. After all, if Yang Cheng Fu/Yang Sau Chung/Gin Soon Chu can practice these methods than it's good enough for me! If you think you know better than them, then so be it.

    I found something off the web a while ago, and saved it because there are not many people who write about dynamic pushing hands besides the Yang Sau Chung lineage teachers/students........

    Quote:
    The suck and blow I was referring to is gentle, and as soon as you get some
    movement you reverse it, creating an oscillation. But they can be used full
    out as well; I suppose you can think of suck as yin and blow as yang, but
    there is more to it than that and you can make some strange variations as
    you can Yang physically but suck (yin) energetically, it becomes a bit like
    throwing a limp sack; it comes from the training technique known as
    Dynamic Pushing Hands. Below is a simplistic explanation of how this
    technique works energetically in training. I will do more posts explaining
    other aspects of it. It is done by visualisation. It is technique that was
    only taught to Yang Family accepted students or lineage holders (disciples
    or family), but since the death of Zhen Ming (Yang Sau Chung) the disciple lines are making it more available. If you go to Chu Gin Soon's website there are (or were) some video clips of it.

    The idea is to get your student to commit themselves completely to pushing
    into your root with as much physical strength as they can muster, you can
    then alternate between "suck and blow" to feel for their energy (Chi) which
    will emerge from behind the physical push. Once you locate it you can tap
    into it with your Chi (if you are able to control it). Chi has an affinity
    for other Chi and because your student won't have the means to control it you can then play with it, but with most students you have to get them to commit their mind to the game in order to keep their Chi out (once you get a
    reaction that reaction is normally fascinating enough for the student to
    keep them focused). Once their Chi is "out" you can use "blow" to compress
    it into their hands to lock them together, or "suck" which tends to make it
    flap around. The hook for the student is that they cannot release the Chi as
    long as they stay focused on it. Some students are so fascinated by it that
    they can't release it themselves even when you break the link with your own
    Chi, so you have to do it for them, others break the energy link very
    quickly either because they don't like it, are worried about it, or it
    generates fear. If you try it with someone who hasn't developed the basic
    Tai-Chi skills (invest in loss) or a physical root and hasn't done the
    apprenticeship, then you are mostly playing with shadows. Though inversely
    you will occasionally find someone where it just pours out!!
    End Quote:

    These aren't my words but they have a ring of truth to my ears. Anyway, I'm about spent on this subject, but I thought I'd speak up a bit for the other side of this discussion. You can choose to believe what is possible and what isn't possible, but if you keep your mind open you may learn more than you ever imagined.

    Good luck in your practice.
     
  14. Florida Warlock

    Florida Warlock Banned Banned

    You actually can fight on bamboo poles. It helps to be in constant motion, which you will or probably should be while fighting, so that you won't lose your balance. How you get up there...

    But I don't know anyone who could pay attention to the fight and their footwork at the same time.
     
  15. nzric

    nzric on lookout for bad guys

    It's a good thing that you have respect for your teacher, and I'll take your word for it that he has good push hands skills.

    But if he puts dodgy-looking ten second clips on the internet, he should expect some criticism. The stuff on the videos is nothing like real tai chi and it brings the whole art down with it. If he has real respect for tai chi, he should either put decent material up or take the videos down altogether.

    Most of the people here weren't criticising his style or his ability - just the terrible material on the clips.
     
  16. piratebrido

    piratebrido internet tough guy

    Don't know whether to laugh or cry.

    That video of the guy blocking the spear strike then sending the other guy flying is aweful. Look at it, you can see the guys force being generated in his legs to fling himself to the floor.

    The dancing one is just a joke. I can't believe someone staged this seriously, it has to be a joke.
     
  17. semphoon

    semphoon walk idiot, walk.

    http://164.58.65.137/wushu/internal/bakmei/part3.mpg

    I like how you can here some people laughing at the guy as he throws himself up into the air.

    There was a great clip on Bullshido about Dim Mak versus MMA...The caption for it read something like "This Chi expert can knockout his own students without touching them. When we introduce another martial artist into the equation it produces hilarious results"

    *snigger
     
  18. ckfnpku

    ckfnpku Valued Member

    What does kids laughing at a guy flying have to do with wether it is real or not?

    Anyways, listen as he pushes him and look at the masters legs and hip. It looks real to me. Hard to tell from a video though.
     
  19. semphoon

    semphoon walk idiot, walk.

    Nothing...


    ...apart from the fact that if I was there I would have been doing the same thing as those kids :D:love: :Angel:
     
  20. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

    You can learn more by looking at the other guy's hips & legs. It looks very fake to me.
     

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