Bruce Lee v. Floyd Mayweather, Jr.

Discussion in 'Jeet Kune Do' started by RisingSun, Jun 17, 2008.

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  1. Semper Fi

    Semper Fi Valued Member

    Who woulda thunk that a BL vs. FM thread would last so long! Bottom line, the world will never know who would win what under whatever rules you throw out there.

    Know yourself and your limitations and work to improve self so that one day you may be able help someone else.
     
  2. BTJRed

    BTJRed New Member

    Just out of curiosity, how exactly has Dan Inosanto misinterpreted Bruce's combat philosophy? Personally, I'd be careful about making statements about the students of Dan's students. You never know who might be one, and might take offense at such a statement and beg that you qualify your statement with something more than opinion. Just a suggestion is all. Naturally we are all entitled to our opinions, but with all the "Prove this." and "Prove that." going around, it might be safer to offer such statements as opinions rather than fact. Again, just a suggestion. I'd like to hear what you have to say about Nonprophets question in regards to how your own instructor might fare against FMJ.
     
  3. Yatezy

    Yatezy One bad mamba jamba

    Chloe Bruce has an awesome body and perfect technique, doesnt mean she can fight.

    We can then say the same about XMA or even the shoalin monks. Can either of these fight? Look what the shoalin monks do, i'd probably say they are more impressive than BL and dedicate themselves to it. I'd still put my money on a proffessional boxer boxer though.
     
  4. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    They both help someone in fighting but are not the only skills necessary to become a great fighter.
     
  5. Yohan

    Yohan In the Spirit of Yohan Supporter

    Doesn't exactly answer my question. yes he was in fantastic physical shape, but this doesn't show his training routines (like what he did on a day to day basis).
     
  6. Gong_Sau_Rick

    Gong_Sau_Rick ultimate WSL nutrider

    I've already wasted enough time leading the JKD horses to water. Just go read some of my older posts. Or you could actually try reading up on JKD sources outside the influence of Dan as well try to comprehend Lee's own writings in their correct context.

    But just to get you started before you go, try... simplicity.

    I never said Dan students aren't any good, I only said I'm more fearful of other BL students' students. The only way this could be viewed as an insult is if the received thought of non-inosanto students of BL were crap.

    Honestly I don't know enough about FMJ (I've never watched any of his fights up until now) to make such a prediction anyway, that's why I didn't comment.
    What is the point of the question anyway, what is the spirit of the question?
     
  7. Yohan

    Yohan In the Spirit of Yohan Supporter

    You do realize that Floyd Mayweather has won 6 world boxing championships in 5 weight classes. Floyd has a PERFECT professional competition record. He has more titles in more weight classes than any other boxer in history. You can argue as to whether he's the best puncher in the world or not. That part is opinion based, but I tend to think the proof is in the pudding here.

    That one's just conjecture, so you got me there.

    My JKD coach teaches us boxing, in fact, boxing is pretty much the foundation of his JKD.

    Doesn't matter - we are using boxing training methods to get a basic foundation so that we can stand and punch, use footwork, defensive techniques, and work on accuracy so that we can pick our targets. We use boxing to learn one of the fundamental skills in fighting: punching. With all the training FM has had in boxing, I'd bet $100 he could punch a guy right in the neck if he wanted to.

    Boxing is the science of punching someone until they are incapacitated. Have you really been watching your boxing? Because in the last fight I watched, somebody got incapacitated.

    Read above. Go watch fights. Read Floyd's wiki.

    By me, because he's won 6 boxing championships, because he's won championships in 5 weight classes, because he's beaten everyone who stepped up to him.

    Well I guess it's me, but he's been judged by boxing experts as the best P4P fighter in the world today.

    Ricky Hatton, Oscar De La Hoya, Zab Judah, Arturio Gatti, Castillo, Vargas, etc . . .

    The proof is public domain. It's available, which is why I haven't been including it in my posts.

    I disagree. Bruce based a lot of his stuff in boxing. It was a big influence on his style, as such, there are going to be similarities in Floyd and his fighting styles.

    You are right about that! I know little about JKD and nothing about Jun Fan, but I don't need to know that much to see that there is no evidence for Bruce being a world class fighter, and plenty of evidence that Floyd IS.

    Don't get me wrong, I think Bruce is tops too. He's really provided me with a great style and training environment.
     
  8. Yohan

    Yohan In the Spirit of Yohan Supporter

    Yeah but let's take a look at the articles it returns.

    http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingforum/16974-broken-knuckles.html - a thread with a boxer talking about rehabbing a broken knuckle.

    http://www.kinjisan.com/boeq.html - info blurb on boxing

    http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080418011027AAbnA77 - guy hit his hand on a wall and broke a knuckle

    http://www.ehow.com/how_2240459_.html - how to condition knuckles

    http://www.soulcast.com/post/show/131859/Boxers - boxing info

    http://realtravel.com/bangkok-journals-j1622392.html - unrelated to boxing

    http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f11/broken-knuckles-305950/ - advice on gloves

    http://travelerstales.com/carpet/002419.shtml - article on thai boxing, no mention of anyone breaking knuckles

    http://www.thesweetscience.com/boxing-article/5075/oscar-floyd-rely-chavez-garcia/ - boxing article on a fight

    See what I'm getting at here?

    Turn me up an article or 2 reporting on a boxer who broke a hand in a street fight and we'll have something.
     
  9. Van Zandt

    Van Zandt Mr. High Kick

    Floyd Patterson is a lot heavier than Bruce, so it wouldn't be a fair match.
     
  10. Yohan

    Yohan In the Spirit of Yohan Supporter

    I neither agree nor disagree with this statement. However the fact that he was training using a 30 year old program leads me to believe that there are better training programs based on modern knowledge that are creating better combat athletes than Bruce Lee.

    Agreed.

    I disagree - his main contribution was his ideas on how and what to train, and how he used those to develop his Martial Art, and how he imparted his training philosophies to other people, who were able to use those training philosophies coupled with legitimate training in other arts to create their own fighting styles. It was his training philosophies that were dandy.

    I neither agree nor disagree with that statement.

    I disagree with that statement. He was probably an exceptional fighter - able to hold his own and train with some of the top combat athletes of his day, while still being a hobbyist. Doesn't make him world class though. Whether he had the potential or not is an entirely different subject.
     
  11. Yohan

    Yohan In the Spirit of Yohan Supporter

    Just understand that I'm taking it in exactly that manner. Don't confuse my aggressive use of language with taking this seriously.
     
  12. Su lin

    Su lin Gone away

    Hang on, did someone bring Bruce Lee back from the dead or something? :D
     
  13. Nonprophet

    Nonprophet New Member

    Rick....you say you know almost nothing about JKD and Jun Fan and yet you speak as though you are an authority. I think it's hard to say that a certain person (considered by most everyone to be the leading instructor in JKD of this time) is misleading his students about JKD and that someone else is going in the right direction when you yourself, admittedly know almost nothing about JKD, it's concepts, where it is or where it was.
     
  14. Arnoo

    Arnoo Work in Progress

    My point was that he was an exceptional fighter not just some "average" fighter. About training programms i dunno he used programms who where ahead of his time and things like cardio and flexibility training didnt change that much + he did alot of experiments with weight training too bad that is badly documented he might be doing the same thing the top weight / fitness instructers are doing today, judging from his cappability's he wasnt training very ineffectivly. Its hard to say what technique's are totally new and made up by himself its the combining of the technique's that counts for me. And if you want to know what kind of training he did thats public knowdlegde but i'd be happy to look it up for you.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2008
  15. JeetKuneDero

    JeetKuneDero Valued Member

    Nevertheless - MADE YOU LOOK - LOL!

    26,0000 plus to go. Oh, wait, you posted 6. That's right, that's how exhaustive your Lee research must've been. Okay, I'll buy that, I can see now why you went with PFM. You're an expert now.

    One more thing, this - here - thread - is - La-La land...ur.... Please, stay calm and remain in your seats people. We hope to have this matter resolved shortly, the lights turned back on and so forth. Please remember to try our other rides, ur... threads. Enjoy your stay at here at La-La Land.

    Respectfully,

    La
     
  16. Yohan

    Yohan In the Spirit of Yohan Supporter

    ??

    I already did the search. My point is, that returning 26k items for a search isn't sufficient evidence to say that boxers break their hands all the time in street fights. What is PFM? I never claimed to be an expert.

    ???

    You are making no sense.
     
  17. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    There's only one thing for it, we'll have to have a whip round to get hold of some of Bruce's DNA and we can clone him. That should settle it.:bang:

    (have you gained a couple of percent in the last few days?)
     
  18. Gong_Sau_Rick

    Gong_Sau_Rick ultimate WSL nutrider

    Wow, I didn't think you could put two straw man fallacies into one sentence. I was wrong.

    First I don't ever recall saying I knew almost nothing about JKD or Jun Fan, and if I did it would probably be in the context of training. For example I'm a major tennis fan, but I've hardly played any tennis. I've done a lot of reading on the subject, as well as talked to many 2nd gen students and one 1st gen student, I also have some unique information about the subject and by nature of what I train in now I know a hell of a lot by proxy.

    Second I never say that I'm an authority, I merely try and point people to authoritative sources of information that are usually ignored by the mainstream JKDers, and maybe even more importantly point out the internal inconsistencies within the entire JKDC movement.

    Please don't misrepresent me like that.

    This is another logical fallacy, argumentum ad verecundiam. argument from authority. Wait actually it's two! argumentum ad numerum. argument from numbers as well.

    You'll actually have to provide some evidence to back up what you say, and more importantly find something that dismantles my own belief system about BL's combat philosophy. It's going to be hard because I think I've heard just about everything; and remember majority opinion is never a guaranteed source of truth.

    At finally, no one knew, truly knew, where BL was going. I have my own idea about where he was going, but it's only provisionally true, it makes the most sense with the information I have available. I however find that some mainstream ideas about where he was going can't possibly be true.

    And I don't mind if people believe things that can't possibly be true, but when they tell other people that what can't possibly be true is true. Well, that's another story...



    ----------

    This thread is nutriding, and logically fallacious in epic proportions.

    The most hilarious thing about this thread is that guys like slipthejab and yohan ask for evidence to support why Bruce Lee was a great fighter and get back only anecdotes and unrelated reports of physical feats that slowly turn into poetic nutrides. Don't get my wrong I suspect BL was a great fighter, but there's really no good evidence to back it up.

    I'm still studying for exams so I'll have to take a break from not only this thread but MAP as a whole for awhile. This is my 999th post so my timing is perfect.

    P.S.

    Stay tuned folks for GONG SAU RICK'S 1000th POST!!! coming to a cinema near you!
     
  19. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    ........and as there is no new evidence since the last time it's an easy argument



    Don't be too long:)
     
  20. callsignfuzzy

    callsignfuzzy Is not a number!

    Well, it was fun while it lasted... sort of... but I think this thread has outlived its usefulness.
     
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