Bokken Basics Aiki Ken

Discussion in 'Weapons' started by koyo, Nov 4, 2007.

  1. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    The bokken often thought of as a "replica "sword is a weapon in it's own right.Many thousands of suburi (solo cuts) must be made to become familiar with the weapon.
    Like the sword proper use of the bokken entales moving the spirit (intention) the bokken the tecnique and the body as one. Example moving the body into position and THEN cutting is of no value this shall bring you into range of the opponent's weapon where you shall be struck while "preparing" your attack.

    In bokken work it is important to assert control in general but over the ken sen (line of the sword) the centreline in particular.

    I shall offer some basics in use of the bokken and attempt to answer any questions you may have.My own training with a bokken goes back decades, I have a mokuroku in aiki ken and jo from Saito shihan 9th dan. I also have had the benefit of help from kendo shihan's Gerry Kincaid and John Hepburn both longtime friends.

    Below a proper cut with the bokken.Note the body alignment and cut directly down the centreline. All of the swordwork in aiki ken must relate directly to the empty hand techniques. There is a saying "Even when unarmed..do not fight FENCE"

    Basic suburi. Hold the bokken in both hands slightly from above, holding from the sides causes the elbows and forearms to stick out easy targets.
    The little fingers grip tightly while the other fingers are firm. The left hand "pulls" the bokken out in an arc while the right hand guides the bokken to the target.On the instant where contact would have been made there is a slight "wringing" of the hands to focus the strike and stabilies the weapon.

    Even whan training alone. Visualise the target area and develop accuracy in the strike.
    Do not go for speed at this point. Ki Ken Tai Ichi is the goal intention to strike the strike and bodymovement co- ordinated and executed as one.

    If this thread is found to be of any value I shall discuss the kata and principles.

    Any questions or input are most welcome.


    regards koyo
     

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    Last edited: Nov 4, 2007
  2. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Taisabaki

    All movements performed during aiki ken are trianfular. All attacks also cover the centreline of the aikidoka allowing attacks that leave no openings.Enten Jizai is a principle which states attack and defence must bo one.Therefor there are no "blocks" as such the attacker's blade may be pressed aside by the incoming strike.

    There are no stances as they are seen to "trap" you even for an instant therfore a stable kamae (posture) is demanded.

    All of these principles transferr to the empty hand techniques where more reliance is placed on evasion and entering than defending with the sword alone.

    Below irrimi entering glancing the blow aside and striking with enten jizai principle.


    regards koyo
     

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    Last edited: Nov 5, 2007
  3. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Below same principle of enten jizai glancing the attack aside and entering to strike

    regards koyo
     

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  4. Archibald

    Archibald A little koala

    Very interesting koyo........please continue :)

    Can you talk about 'creating' openings? This is something I have become very interested in lately, particularly training with people who hold their centerline very tightly and do not 'give' anything away.

    In our system of ju jutsu, the underlying tactic is to 'present' a target - example, shift your guard slightly to the left of your head, inviting a circular attack from the right - and then take it away when an attack has been launched, moving the body offline while entering and attacking the opening your opponent has now created. Our kenjutsu kata (albeit the few that remain in the system) follow the same principle.

    Thoughts? I find it hard to make this work on people who 'see through' the trap (though that might be simply saying something about my abilities to lay them).
     
  5. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Hi Archie

    Below you can see me holding waki kamae faced by jodan kamae. Some western swordsemn call the same kamae in their sytem the "fool".
    Fool for holding such a vulnerable kamae or on the other hand fool should someone attack into an obvious trap.
    There is another principle that says attacked on the left side as would be this case use you right side to counter attack. Which would follow the description you have given.
    AS for drawing an attack we tend to lower our handblade defence to draw an attack to the face or raise it to draw an attack to the abdomen.

    I find if someone is holding a powerful "closed" kamae that an aggresive (perhaps obvious) attack to the eyes tends to draw the arm up creating an opening in chudan (middle) if this is struck their guard tends to come down leaving an opening in jodan (high) again just like their balance this only happens for an instant before they recover.

    I have had many enjoyable "encounters" with friends from different arts who all move and react (or not) in their own ways.I suppose it comes down to experience don't "look" too hard and learn to go from 1 to 100% in an instant.



    regards koyo
     

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  6. KSW_123

    KSW_123 Valued Member

    This is true in our style as well, but someone just learning would not be aware of this. What you described is the destination, I am interested in the path you would take a beginner to reach this destination.

    The way I trained was something like this.
    Learn how to cut while kneeling.
    Learn how to cut while standing.
    Then we start to move. In the beginning we teach to step first and then strike. For a beginner at this stage there is a noticable gap from foot hitting ground to sword reaching target point. As time goes on this gap is closed down, such that at the point the foot touches the floor the sword is just ready to touch the target.

    In our system the path to learning favors stability of stance during the learning process.

    I can just as easily see it going the other way where the cut would come sooner.

    I can also see that one could learn by trying to get the timing correct right off the bat.

    The first two methods would be providing a path for the student whereas the final would be more that student finds his own path.
     
  7. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    We have seven basic suburi. In ALL of them there is body movement alongside the strike with the emphasis on the body alignment and strike being at the same instant. We should NOT go on to paired kata work before this. Since many thousand of suburi are needed to achieve this many instructors allow training in paired kata in my opinion too early. Since our unarmed art mirrors the sword principles ALL strikes must take place at the instant that body entry or alignment is achieved. This is our manner of training.This is down to using sword principles in the empty hand techniques.
    Perhaps it is a modern adaptation as few have the patience to practice the many hours of solo work before going on to the "good stuff". :)
    However if other manners of training eventually lead to effective results that is fine.

    I would point out that my posts are from my experience in Japanese sword work and while I learn a great deal from the posts of others I am more than sympathetic to other approaches. As stolenbjorn, a western swordsman, said a sword is a sword a man is a man so we shall always find far more similarities than differences. Thank you for your input guys and I look forward to your future posts.



    Below creating an opening in chudan by attacking jodan the body alignment and strike happen at the sam instant.ALL unbalncing is accompanied with an atemi.

    regards koyo

    Edit
    Jodan (high level)
    chudan (middle level)
    Atemi (strikes)
     

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    Last edited: Nov 6, 2007
  8. KSW_123

    KSW_123 Valued Member

    Koyo, I learn alot from reading your posts. Great stuff. My only hangup is the japanese termonology, which you always nicely translate. I just don't know how to pronounce the words in my head, and for some reason it slows down my thinking.

    I see more differences in training methods to achieve a goal rather than the goals being different.
     
  9. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    My thanks .It is always good when a thread is about the exchange of information rather than "opinions" I think that the 'differences' are always in techniques never in principles.

    regards koyo
     
  10. Cervantes

    Cervantes Valued Member

    Very nice, another thing learned and stimulated to go and learn again even more. Thanks
     
  11. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    KEN SEN
    In martial arts it is important to assert conrol in general but over the centreline in partisular. In aiki ken this is called ken sen . If we face each other with the swords in middle posture and threatening the face, by using triangular posture sharpend we can thrust along the line of his sword.Similarly any strikes are best made at this angle rather than punch "around" his defending arm.

    The art is performed from a triangular posture which is sharpened to allow us to "slip up the side" or as it is called enter.

    Below a demonstration of the sharpened posture. You can see the line of the sword and the triangulr entry.I have made no attempt to attack so as to show the angle more clearly.

    regards koyo

    ken sen (line of the sword)
    hito emi ( triangle "making the body small")
    irrimi (entering)
    chudan no kamae (middle posture)

    Cervantese welcome aboard any input welcomed.
     

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    Last edited: Nov 6, 2007
  12. Langenschwert

    Langenschwert Molon Labe

    I was hoping you'd start a thread like this, Bill. :)

    I agree on the 1 to 100 in an instant. As soon as there's an opening you like, hit it with conviction. Any given stance in swordsmanship will close some openings and leave others open. That's the whole point really, in addition to (more importantly) having a spiffy place to attack from. The trick is to use an attack that makes it hard for the opponent to defend easily. Hence the German Meisterhauen (Master Strikes) that are designed to break a particular guard. In the German system, the appropriate Master Strike will allow one to attack a particular guard in (relative) safety. What generally results is a bind, since in selecting the correct strike, you have eliminated as much as possible a direct "single time" counterattack, leaving the opponent to strike your blade in some fashion, or void (get out of the way) entirely.

    Which all comes down to "hit the guy where the sword ain't". React if (and only if) he tries to thwart your incoming attack, and don't let him withdraw without injury.

    Keep it coming Bill. Hopefully I'll be able to start interalizing all the Aiki Ken lingo and not have to keep looking things up. :)

    Very best regards,

    -Mark
     
  13. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Hi langenswert and welcome buddy.

    Something that is not often discussed is the fact that should two experts fight then likely hood is that both shall "die" Should you fight someone less skilled one dies the other is injured fight a fool and HE dies.

    This is down to SUKI openings offered when you attack or in your posture or spirit. It is almost impossible to attack effectively against a master with a "closed" kamae.

    This is why we attempt to "see" any openings as the enemy approaches, any openings his attack offers also any openings in his fighting spirit.

    It is most important to avoid aiki which means when you are moving in the same rythm. Timing is learned so that you can break his timing even control his timing. The same applies to distancing.

    regards koyo
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2007
  14. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Below in the respective kamae Jack is vulnerable to a thrust middle area while I am vulnerable to a downward thrust from above. However whoever moves first shall leave an opening. Any movement must be applied along (outside) of the line of the sword and break the rythm. Difficult to see in a photograph but I am sure you understand this principle.


    regards koyo

    Note the point (kisaki) of the swords threaten the eyes.This is an important principle which shall be discussed later.
     

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    Last edited: Nov 10, 2007
  15. Kogusoku

    Kogusoku 髭また伸びた! Supporter

    Ichi no tachi,

    You can see where that kasumi cut is going to if you adjust the aikiken ma-ai to the older koryu kenjutsu ma-ai.
     
  16. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    Right on !! I have just slid back to adjust the maai.The ichi no tachi is from Kashima ryu. Alternately rather than slide back I could have "released" my right hand from the tsuka to avoid the cut to the forearm.


    regards koyo
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2007
  17. Archibald

    Archibald A little koala

    Bump.

    I'm still interested :love:
     
  18. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    In post 14 it can be seen that the points of the swords threaten the eyes of the respective swordsmen. In aiki ken and empty hand the sword point or leed hand threatens the attacker's eys . I read in another thread thata fellow had left sport swordsmanship because his instructor demanded that all his attacks should be linear.

    All effective attacks are indeed liniear albeit with a triangular posture to take the body just out of line of the sword. In hand techniques this is the same. Rather than attempt to punch around the guard we strike triangularly "along the line of the sword" With our fist sliding along the forearm of the defender.

    Below what looks like a direct cut into the knife has been executed triangularly taking the body off line of attack while striking directly along the perceived line of the sword.
    (If he were holding a sword the strike would run along the blade at an angle)

    Another element of aiki ken is that we must attempt to strike armed or unarmed , through the attacker to a weakpoint of balance.

    weakpoint of balance KUZUSHI
    line of sword KEN SEN
    triangular entry HITO EMI
    swordpoint KISAKI

    REGARDS KOYO
     

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  19. Archibald

    Archibald A little koala

    koyo...

    We follow this same principle - not staying in front of your opponents ken sen - is Tsutsumi Ju Jutsu aswell.

    Our system is built on 5 basic taisabaki (body movements) - combined with unbalancing they are all designed to place you in a position where uke can no longer strike you effectively. Usually this means close to his back as possible.

    There are tradeoffs of speed and position. Irimi Senkai will put you practically behind uke. Nagashi ('flowing') simply puts you on the 'outside' of the attacking limb, but it is the fastest body movement and therefore the most commonly used, particularly against 'real' punches.

    I've said before, we follow a slightly different tactic of creating openings - we stand with our kamae open - hands up but our hips square and large to the opponent - to 'offer' a target. When an attack has been launched THEN we move triangularly offline to make ourselves small. Offering a target and taking it away. Our sword work follows the same tactics.

    I filmed our end of year demonstration last weekend - as soon as I get my hands on a dv cable I will upload some vids so you can get a glimpse of our Ju jutsu and Aikido. With permission from Francis (Kensei1984) I'll upload the throw that had him going to hospital with a bandaged arm :love:

    Can we talk about Uchi Otoshi (that's what it's called in kendo, anyway) or 'killing the cut'? Striking an oncoming attack to take all the impudence out of it and open up uke for a counterstrike. Sword vs sword or hand to hand...
    I knocked James' bokken out of his hands on Saturday doing this....I find it a fascinating technique :)
     
  20. koyo

    koyo Passed away, but always remembered. RIP.

    We have three major timings. Sen (meaning instinct) when we move off line and attack. Sen no sen when we see the attack coming and cut rhough it and sen sen no sen when we attack his intention to attack and cut or strike him down before he can react. The one you speak of sounds like sen no sen cutting through the attack.

    This depends on the ability to go from alert to 100% attack in an instant. Our attacking sword or hand must also protect our centreline so the attack depends upon proper body alignment with the opponent and the ability to mount a decisive strike instantly upon any opening offered in the opponent's postures (posture of the body posture or attitude of mind)

    Below as Derek raised his sword to strike I instantly cut through him striking his sword aside then using tai atari striking his body with mine on the instant he was unbalanced.

    I particularly favour this technique because I am not "heavy" and need to use timing and distancing to my advantage.Also I must use kuzushi (weak point of balance in the attacker)


    regards koyo
     

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    Last edited: Nov 20, 2007

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