Discussion in 'Filipino Martial Arts' started by ptkalista, Jun 17, 2007.
Smokey is welcome to post on this forum, thanks very much.
Yeah gillette rules!!! I got hundreds of knives in my house especially in the kitchen.
People who are afraid of the blade gun down the wielder in a snap.
One could just as easily say "if you want to play with knives, get a job as a butcher."
Wow...Step away for a night and this thread just explodes!!
In areas of the world where everyday blade use is common and restrictions on the possession of firearms exist, you see a "culture of the blade". It is a common weapon and is ubiquitous, easily concealed, and takes no skill to use in a criminal fashion (just like any tool or weapon in the hands of a criminal). Even in the war torn areas of the near and middle east, the culture of the blade still exists (look at the Afghan population) There are several African cultures, Mexico and even more that have utilized and still utilize the blade as a tool for everyday and self protection. The Philippines definitely has a high daily use for the blade as well as many arts that are fantastic with the blade as well. Now, clearly we all know that PTK has been teaching the Philippine Marines Kali work, but as with all Military personnel the blade is a secondary weapon to their firearm. Someone runs at them with a blade, they get shot.
I disagree with you that Firearms take no skill. Like I stated before, in the hands of a criminal it takes no skill. But lets look at CQB house clearing, modern ISPC and various skill based competitions, Military, and SWAT training, these take no skill? I have personally witnessed Navy SEALs, shooting and let me tell you it takes extreme skill. I shoot weekly and I practice for accuracy under pressure (just like my martial arts practice) and it takes skill. If it takes no skill why then does GT Gaje advocate shooting so much? Never mind the shotgun he keeps ready....
FMA is more than just blade use. The arts have originated from the use of the blade, and many still continue this tradition, but as with anything evolution takes place! Sticks are utilized, flexible weapons,projectiles, firearms...whatever it takes to stop an attacker should be a part of your training, this is evolution in real time.
True. But we should thank you for getting the thread back on track so that we're actually saying something again.
Forgot to thank you for splitting the threads! Great job in moderating!!
Cheers Steve! I'm learning.
The FMA philosophy of All Blade All the Time is what catapulted the true FMA technology to the forefront of history. I am merely saying we need to continue this very well researched and tested proven technology. Nothing compares to the true FMA blade culture, from the movement alone you can recognize this. A mere criminal who just stabs like an animal is no match for someone trained in the true FMA technology who has the powers of footwork and well proven techniques from our ancient forefathers.
I am not here to talk about GT Gaje or the PTK training or PTK, I am neither instructor nor master, mine is not to ask why mine is but to do or die. If you have issues with GT Gaje talk to him directly. I am only here to discuss the true FMA blade culture, its impending lost at the hands of lesser skilled promoters of the art and how we can return to the truth of a well tested tradition.
I stand by what I said about guns being less than blades. It takes absolutely no skill to shoot a gun (unless you are a sniper and you are 1 mile away from your target, because at this level it is not mechanical anymore but intuitive). You point, concentrate on the front sight and shoot. Now breeching, house clearing, searching is not shooting these are movements a team perfects to be able to move through an environment safely. If they have to engage you go back to the above: You point, concentrate on the front sight and shoot. This is why anybody can pick up a gun and kill another person. The blade is more personal it requires courage to use because its up close and personal. Because its up close and personal people who use the blade, who actually train, are closer to the truth.
Its one thing to use a dirk, dagger, or a sword as a criminal without training (yes, you can still kill someone without training), or to cut an infidel's head off using a sword as they do in Afghanistan or Iraq. Just because they use blades in these context does not mean they possess the technology or a blade culture. You can tell a blade culture from a place of chaos from the amount of reverence they put on their blades and the veracity. If you see your soul in your blade and the blade reflects its soul back to you, then this is the highest in the true FMA blade culture. This is when you acquire the flavor, why would you chose to lose this flavor when this recipe for killing success has been perfected over centuries. The true FMA blade is the truth, and it is the last one, so we need to protect it, not forget it.
Are you associated with P. Greg Alland, by any chance?
I'm going to try and start over here: Philosophy and "flavour" aside, how would you go about encouraging a return to blade culture? What should practitioners actually do in your view?
Pick up the blade, return to training with the blade. If you feel insecure, then do the blade movements by yourself and as you progress wean yourself off the stick and train more with the blade. You will get cut yes but with control these cuts will only be minor. There are many schools that are still very much blade oriented, so my advise is to go to this schools and be cynical about schools that just promote the stick. You can do more with a blade than a stick and the blade can do everything a stick can do. So why choose a toy if you can play with the real thing? Once you go blade you never go stick is what I say always. :woo:
I'm Filipino, why would I learn from a white man? :woo:
Because, believe it or not, white men are capable of learning and then teaching FMA.
Then, yet again, I ask you what you do in practice. I've done a couple of Kalis Illustrisimo classes, which were much more blade oriented than the Doce Pares and Modern Arnis I was used to. And I could tell you precisely what we did in those classes. It wasn't live blade, but we did use practice swords to practice various attack and defense combinations.
But, again, that's not live blade. So what are you prescribing?
If you wanted to learn Chinese, who would you go to? A Chinese or A White or Black man who learned Chinese through Rosetta Stone (which by the way is a rip off) and has never visited China?
I'd go to the person with the best reputation and who had demonstrated the qualities I was looking for in a teacher. I'd be a fool to trust one teacher more than another simply based on his ethnicity. And you're at risk of alienating a great many legitimate FMA practitioners based on the same flimsy logic.
Do you see the irony of learning the true FMA from a White man. I still think Filipinos are the best recepticles for this knowledge, because FMA blade culture is just not about blade there is culture involved. As a Filipino why would I go to a non-Filipino to learn my true Filipino blade culture? But this is just my opinion.
I'm not promoting a school or a style. So when I say just drop your stick and pick up the blade, that is exactly what I'm prescribing. All FMA came from the blade, each style was tested during WWII and still today in the Philippines. So it's just a matter of returning to the blade. Once you become proficient then you'll want to push yourself, and you would then have gotten a little flavor and you'd want more so then go to where the flavor is.
You're a broken record at this point, PT. You stalwartly refuse to answer any questions about actual training methodology. You belittle earnest practitioners of recognized FMA styles. And you don't offer anything beyond pithy little catch phrases about souls, blades, and flavour.
I've tried to debate you on solid points and counterpoints. But now I realize that isn't possible. Your credibility with me is pretty well shot, I'm afraid.
I'm pretty clear, at that point, on where the flavour isn't.
The blade culture isn't for everyman, just like everyone isn't a warrior. If we were all cut from the warrior class it would be a better world, but in any given society there are artists, merchants, politicians, and computer geeks.
Don't hate the blade because you fear it. Fear leads to hate, hate leads to anger, anger leads to hate and as we all know hate leads to very shoddy training in sticks, because we've locked up our blades because we fear using them. :woo:
You say This is Madness. Well I say ...
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