BJJ slamming vs wrestling slamming

Discussion in 'Brazilian Jiu Jitsu' started by roninmaster, Nov 30, 2014.

  1. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    I'm fairly certain (dunno what the official rules are, but from what I've seen at comps) referees give you leeway for that. If you're in the middle of taking someone down and they jump the its not counted against you as its outside your control. At least, I've been dropped from singles before and jumped to try and get as good a position as I could out of it and my opponents weren't DQ'd.

    Slamming from the stand up is only a foul if someone jumps and the receiver very blatantly comes down hard on top. You have to make an effort still though. I've forced people down hard for doing it and been fine, probably because I did it with my arms while technically trying to do the correct counter but not caring if it hurt him or not. Its more like if I jumped on you and you essentially came off your feet trying to drive a shoulder in or something.

    I should add that on the other side of it even if its a contrived rule I don't think its a bad one, and I'm on the side of people who think it shouldn't be removed.
     
  2. FunnyBadger

    FunnyBadger I love food :)

    Then why not skip the standing phase and have it start kneeling or something? If bjj'ers are so keen to get to the mat to start ground grappling then why not start the match on the ground?

    EDIT - I dont think that would be a bad thing per say, I'm not trying to knock bjj here but if that's what the folks want :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2014
  3. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    what season of tuf was it when the guys got into a drunken brawl, in the brawl one dude tried to arm bar someone else and got his head slammed into the concrete?
     
  4. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Exactly. No guard slamming is a convention in order to promote a certain style of competition.
    If you want to guard slam people go do some other style of grappling I say.
     
  5. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    See now I don't regard those as slams! They are throw with the intention of taking down and scoring.

    Some of these are slams:

    [ame]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yW0-FtqSFLs[/ame]
     
  6. Van Zandt

    Van Zandt Mr. High Kick

    I think stacking is worse than slamming.
     
  7. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Like I said it's a rule that favors a type of play - it's a rule, but not one I am a huge fan of.

    That said at 3:04 there is a move that is pretty much the same as a suplex though, so clearly standard wrestling would have some issues in BJJ ruleset too
     
  8. MaxSmith

    MaxSmith Valued Member

    Yeah, typing on a iphone has its drawbacks :hat:
     
  9. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Well I don't like people who win by pin. "Oh noes, I shall be cuddled to boredom, nooooo...." :p

    Agreed, I wouldn't dq that.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2014
  10. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    personally, if you jump to guard, i think i'd be in favor of a hard slam onto the back.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2014
  11. MaxSmith

    MaxSmith Valued Member

    Me either.
     
  12. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    That video does show there is a possible safety element to the slam ban too. Its hard to be thrown or taken down and not find a way to land relatively safely, or at least take the majority of the hit to the back. It seems a lot more likely for the back of your head to take the brunt of it with a guard slam. Which makes a lot of sense now I think about it.
     
  13. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    With a rotational throw the focus (thats not quite the right word) of the throw tends to be tghe feet, with an unstopped guard slam the focus will be the neck and back of the head.

    In addition competition rules arnt supposed to be MMA lite, but to promote the standard positional play of bjj whilst enabling safe bouts.

    But jumping guard (which is different to pulling) exploits this safety rule.

    But its not the magic weakness everyone here seems to be making out, people dont do it all the time, theyre well aware of its weaknessess and anyone higher then a bluebelt can easily stop and resweep of a slam attempt by a newbie.
     
  14. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Bottom guy hooked the leg and top guy 'slammed' him a few inches and shook off the armbar in good base and posture.

    As noone was hurt and both were skilled grapplers thats a terrible example to use.
     
  15. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    [ame]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ot7h6ykC0kU[/ame]

    Heres a great example of why slamming isnt allowed, and why moves that are like slamming but arnt are allowed, iirc gabi does an excellent shake off to the guard attack of dern here.
     
  16. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    agreed. i think, as you mention, there is a serious safety issue. i'm not against the rule personally, even though i stated that i wouldn't mind a slam in a jumping-to-guard situation. but yes, the safety of the competitors needs to be addressed. as a fragile old dude, i get it.

    didn't the scissor sweep in judo (sorry, don't remember the exact term) get banned after yasuhiro yamashita suffered a broken ankle (or something of the sort) during the '84 olympics?
     
  17. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Jumping scissors got banned after the high level injury, but also because a lot of people got injured in training and low level competition with it.

    Iirc its also banned by the ibjjf.
     
  18. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    Yep it is. Happy about it too. I've spent the last year more or less practising various heel hooks and I've still never been in more fear of my knees than I have the one time a dan grade judoka showed me a scissor takedown. It was horrible.
     
  19. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    http://www.usawks.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=175851
    Further context -

    Theres a no unnecessary slamming rule in wrestling, I linked it in the first few posts of this thread.
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2014
  20. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award


    [ame]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7ix8Yw5zUEE[/ame]


    Cough cough........ pot calling kettle.......
     

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