armbar escapes

Discussion in 'MMA' started by xubis, Nov 13, 2003.

  1. xubis

    xubis New Member

    My sensei got me locked in a laying armbar, (the one where use use the inside of the leg to put pressure on the eblow join or shoulder socket) and I couldn't for the life of me think of a way to escape, any of you guys got ideas?
     
  2. gojuman

    gojuman Valued Member

    Once you're there your stuck, man. When this hold ( if I understand your description ) is applied in "full contact" your arm is dislocated at the elbow and/or shoulder. In submission fighting I think it is time to submit if your opponent gets you here.
     
  3. stump

    stump Supersub

    YOu can sometimes roll over your shoulder and come up in the north south position....sometimes.
     
  4. Freeform

    Freeform Fully operational War-Pig Supporter

    This is going to sound trite, but don't get caught. Don't extend your arm out, especially if your between his legs (in the best paauuusible taste ;) ).

    If its locked on, its locked on, you ain't getting out piggie! :D

    Although you can always role over your own head backwards! ;)

    Col
     
  5. stump

    stump Supersub

    Get your head inside his leg holding you down and sit up
     
  6. SoKKlab

    SoKKlab The Cwtch of Death!

    If I'm understanding you correctly, you are talking about JujiGatame-a lying armbar and variations of it (?), where you are on your back and yr arm is splayed out Christ like.

    Firstly turn the hand that is in his grasp so that yr thumb is no longer pointing up, but instead your palm is flat to his chest, this will relieve some pressure on the elbow joint.

    Legal ways of getting out of it are as Stump says sit up grab your own arm, if your opponent is a very good grappler, then they'll know a counter to yr counter and so on but at least you are out of the Arm Bar.

    You can also bridge out of this move, which I have done many times, but it takes a certain amount of 'steel', as there's only a certain amount of time that you can resist the pressure.

    The way you have described it here, the opponents leg is levering yr arm for extra leverage, this is quite a nasty one, but you can turn out of it, again as Stump said into a North/ south position.

    Although it is worth trying to get out of these things, it's a judgement call on yr behalf as to how much you resist. Common sense should prevail.

    If in doubt-tap out,
    it's not worth hyperflexing/ breaking etc yr joint for.
     
  7. stump

    stump Supersub

    Agreed....have the common sense to tap when you're beaten!!!:)
     
  8. Matt_Bernius

    Matt_Bernius a student and a teacher

    Or you can take a page out of John Saxton's play book and bite the close leg (if it's laying near your face). I mean I worked on Bolo Yueng in "Enter the Dragon." Of course that isn't quite Kosher in the ring.

    There's a great Filipino variation (or at least I was introduced to it in the Filipino arts) on the Arm Bar where the "far leg" wraps over the arm and the foot hooks around the back of the "lockee's" head specifically to avoid allowing the lockee the opportunity to bite you.

    - Matt
     
  9. stump

    stump Supersub

    THe biting the leg defense if overrated....try it and you'll get his heel thumping your face repeatedly. You don't want to be there.
     
  10. Andrew Green

    Andrew Green Member

    push one leg over his head and sit up into his guard

    Push both legs over his head and sit up to side mount

    Push both his legs down towards your legs and sit up

    Swing both your legs up, then down using the momentum to sit up into hm, stack him and work your arm out while keeping him stacked

    Bridge, shrimp away and tuck your elbow into your side, pulling it through and under him.

    etc...


    What works depends on what his position is and where he is applying pressure. If he is doing everything right, tap out.
     
  11. xubis

    xubis New Member

    Thanks guys, I will try some of these out.
     
  12. xubis

    xubis New Member

    Oh just another question, I don't do a grappling art but we often get out some mats and do very basics, in a grappling art, in a sparring situation, can joints be broken if they don't tap
     
  13. stump

    stump Supersub

    Yes!!! 0 If not broken then hyperextended, damaged etc
     
  14. Matt_Bernius

    Matt_Bernius a student and a teacher

    Yes! Beasically, and most generally, the difference between a lock and a break is speed. Just about any joint lock executed fast enough will break, hyperextend, or dislocate a joint. Additionally if you apply it slowly but continue to extend the lock it can also break the joint.

    It's important to also understand that flexibility and sensitivity should be taken into account by both people. It's m understanding that most people don't feel leg locks as quickly as arm locks. So the danger is that by the time you "really" feel the lock you're alreay getting into the dangerous area. Also with some flexible people by the time they "feel" the lock you've come dangerously close to breaking things on them. Bottom line, especially for beginners, you should never "force" locks that aren't working. You risk injuring you partner or sometimes yourself. It's better to give them up and try something else, or reset the position and start from the top.

    - Matt
     
  15. xubis

    xubis New Member

    Hmm... call me a pussy, but I would never really want to break someone arm in a sparring situation if they didn't tap :-/
     
  16. Andrew Green

    Andrew Green Member

    You should know when you got it, and when you got pressure on the right place. Comes from experience

    If the guy won't tap stop and ask him why he isn't tapping

    If he just refuses to, even when he is hurting don't train with him, and tell the instructor.
     
  17. xubis

    xubis New Member

    Yeah do you get a lot of the "I am too hardcore to tap" type people?
     
  18. stump

    stump Supersub

    I don't mean it should happen...only it could. When you're rolling you can go pretty close to the mark and the tap is the best safely mechanism. If someone refuses to tap it can be for a few reasons.

    1, they're a muppet.

    2, they're trying to stretch their boundaries or work counters

    3, your sub attempt may not be on correctly....tapping to an improperly applied sub is not helping your training partner.

    If it's number two then sometimes you can sail a little close to the edge and sometimes you can get unlucky. Such is MA training...sometimes you get injured. As Andrew said you can stop at any time and noone said you have to train with that partner. And everyone should be responsible for their own and their partners safety.

    To be honest people normally grow out of the too tough to tap mentality as soon as they roll with someone with more experience who completely owns them :)
     
  19. xubis

    xubis New Member

    Lol
     

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