2 Kids got mugged at my school

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by KSprenk, Jan 19, 2006.

  1. KSprenk

    KSprenk be

    Yesterday during lunch( the school lets us go out to eat during lunch) two kids were walking through a church parking lot. A man yelled at them and the kept on walking. Then he ran up to the kids and showed them a gun and told them to give up their wallets. The did and nobody got hurt and the police are still investigating. Some kids around my school are all talkin big saying"Oh I wouldve just punched him in the face".
    I think these kids did the right thing and It got me thinking. What would it take for you to attack or try to disarm a man with a gun? I would only try to disarm him if I was sure he was going to harm me or my friends. What would you do?
     
  2. Big Will

    Big Will NinpƓ Ikkan

    Same as you would. It would be an unnecessary risk to try to disarm him if there's really no deadly threat in the situation. This might depend on the level of skill one has as well, of course, but as I see it, no one is a perfect martial artist and something could go wrong. Then it would be better to lose your money rather than your life.
     
  3. whiteshadow711j

    whiteshadow711j Hiding in the Shadows

    Thats a really tough question,
    you have to take in all the factors before even thinking of trying some muto dori to get the gun away from the attacker. What does the guy look like, what mental state is he in, does he have some skill with the handgun, you can tell how they hold it and point it at you. :woo: Hard questions to ask are the risks, is is worth it, are you skilled enough, do you have enough confidence in your skill/abilities to take the person down. Are you ready to get shot or have another person who is with you shot, remember gun powder burns hurt too, plus the sheer loudness of the gun going off will startle someone not trained with guns.. :cry:

    also be prepared if you do intend to stop the attacker that you need to take him down hard and fast and be prepared to kill if need be :eek:
    like I said Very tough questions...
     
  4. xen

    xen insanity by design

    thats the sort of question you can't second-guess... until you've been there you don't know how'd you react... i haven't, thankfully, but in the situation you describe above, give the man the wallet and try not get his back up... its a wallet, everything inside it can be replaced... you only get one brain and it don't work so well with a hole going through it... (ditto for heart and liver)

    all the other types of scenario, protecting family etc... you can only call it when it happens... it could be worse to try and disarm and fail... it depends on what is demanded... it depends on if the guy is an out and out psycho whose decided when he got up that today he'd find someone to put a bullet into... or if its someone whos just scared and confused, found themselves out their depth and can be talked into believing it would be better to put the gun down...

    or... or...or...

    the list is endless...
     
  5. specourt

    specourt Hero in a half-wit shell

    100%

    If you've got $1,000,000 in your wallet it's a small price for your life.

    However, we have a situation in the UK where it is becoming the the fashion to steal your belongings, and then kill you anyway for respect .
    So what do you do?
    You find out when you're faced with it. :)
     
  6. Brad Ellin

    Brad Ellin Baba

    Hand over the money. No question about that at all. Fortunately (or unfortunately depending on how you want to look at it) I have trained extensively on gun disarms and retention. Still, unless I felt that my life was in danger, for certain, I'd just hand over the money. Keep a calm voice, don't make any sudden moves and try to keep the adrenaline factor low. Then, as quickly as possible, put something between you and the gun wielding maniac. Preferably something the bullet won't penetrate. Don't try to disarm the other person unless you are given no choice. Expect to get shot and you have a better than average chance of surviving.
     
  7. slipthejab

    slipthejab Hark, a vagrant! Supporter

    LOL!:D
    Are you for real?! :eek:
     
  8. whiteshadow711j

    whiteshadow711j Hiding in the Shadows

    Yes I am :cool:

    You got a problem with that.
     
  9. whiteshadow711j

    whiteshadow711j Hiding in the Shadows

    By the way, when was the last time you were mugged ?

    I was twice (once in 2001 in nyc and another time in 2002 in nj), and came out on top both times. And when I say on top I mean he was on the ground locked up with a wrist lock (kime waza roppo) after being omotegyaku'ed or knocked out on the ground by a few punches and a kick to the gut.

    Any questions...
     
  10. Lord Spooky

    Lord Spooky Banned Banned

    Yeah he'll probably ask you for video evidence! :rolleyes:
     
  11. Dr.Syn

    Dr.Syn Valued Member

    Words of wisdom here..Please don't try any of that crap you see on TV..Having your knee joint destroyed by a bullet because a disarm technique didn't go as plan isn't worth the 10, 20 or 30 dollars that yu have on you..
     
  12. Johnno

    Johnno Valued Member

    Yes, I've got a question. In these incidents, was the mugger using a gun?
     
  13. scorpiousmac

    scorpiousmac Valued Member

    Run,Run far away,then try to find out where he lives and pan the ___ out of him.As Specort mentioned earlier if people draw a gun and try to mug you over here theres a good chance that they will do you in no matter what you do.Dont know why they think their getting respect as the criminal fraternity dont like it as it's more than likely going to result in more people fighting back thinking they have nothing to lose.It's a changing world out there with little kids getting raped and people getting blown to pieces even when they do comply with muggers/robbers demands.Guns have got to be a ma's worst nightmare and until the time comes I've no idea what i would do in that situation and even less of an idea of whether it was the right thing to do,would he shoot would'nt he shoot?I dont know...do you?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 20, 2006
  14. whiteshadow711j

    whiteshadow711j Hiding in the Shadows

    actually the 1st was a knife and the second was a .38 revolver.
     
  15. Banpen Fugyo

    Banpen Fugyo 10000 Changes No Surprise

    I Love Kime Waza Roppo. May I ask which technique it was?
     
  16. whiteshadow711j

    whiteshadow711j Hiding in the Shadows

    Just the 1st one from omote gyaku, (right leg under the opponents right arm while stepping under the opponents right shoulder), the basic.

    Of course I had to hold the guy there on the ground for like 5-10 mins, and let me tell you, 5-10 mins is a long time, then transit authority cops came, took the guy into custody and took my statement. It helped that the lady who was in the token booth saw the whole thing and called the transit cops. The transit lady in the booth advised me of this when I was holding he guy in the lock via loud speaker that the cops were on their way.

    I remember telling the guy not to move the whole time and advised him that I would kick him if he moved.

    the location was at the chambers st subway to take the 2/3 train uptown to 34 penn station. I worked at 60 hudson st in nyc.

    By the way after the cops took my statement, I missed my train back to nj that night at 12:30 am in the morning at penn station so I sat in a bar (mustang harry's) sipping a glenmorangie scotch about a block south from 34 penn station until the next train came in at about 2am in the morning to take me back to nj. I let my girlfriend at the time know that I missed the train and would take a cab home when I got off at the edison nj stop.

    The gun incident was not cool as I was real tired and matter factly coming back from martial arts (ninjutsu) training. I was leaving bound brook (that is where my old teacher Sandro Panebianco used to teach) and couldn't take the normal way back, rte 285 south, because of heavy rains that night as the area was flooded, I wound up in a bad area (plainfield) and got lost so I stopped at a gas station and got directions, then on the way back to my car I was mugged by some african american kid who looked doped up, I was scared but remained calm and then got on the ground and groveled for my life while telling him I would give him my money (it's called misdirection), at that point I was real close to him and stepped up and to the right, while using my left hand to hold his right arm (actually partly his hand and his wrist) that was holding the gun and hit him in the face and neck with my right hand that was holding my car keys and kicked him in the stomach with my left foot. note= I didn't have any money on me and was worried I would get shot if I told the scumbag, I was wearing my gi pants and a black t-shirt from training, gi pants dont have pockets to hold a wallet (the gi top/jacket and my wallet and stuff were in my car) the only thing I had was my car keys and my car was locked and about 5-7 feet from where I was stopped. When he went down to the ground the gun went off, and thank god for my one uncle (uncle john, on my fathers side is in the FBI and tought me all about guns, how to handle them, the dangers, how to fire them, etc). The gas station attendent heard the shot, ran out and saw the guy with the gun and me fighting and called the Plainfield police department. I had knocked the guy out by that time and kicked the gun away from the guy. The police came, took my statement, took the guy and the guys gun and 6 months later I was in court testifying about what happened and the guy went to jail for about 3 years (3 years thats it, he could have killed me) man it just "@$#$%%&" me off that he didn't get more time.

    By the way I dont talk about the gun mugging alot, but I have talked about the knife mugging in new york before on martial arts planet under the ninjutsu forum.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2006
  17. whiteshadow711j

    whiteshadow711j Hiding in the Shadows

    by the way here is one of my original posts from the past on the knife mugging.

    http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=40115

    post #9

    (I had a similar experience, see below (copied from another thread)

    "When I was working in new york I was mugged in the subway by a guy with a knife and I took in all the factors,

    how big he was.. he was smaller than me
    how he was holding the knife..awkwardly
    what he looked like, wearing, etc.. scruffy looking, possibly a street person
    and his state of being..he looked a little drunk and a little nervous
    smell...he smelled like he had alcohol on his breath

    and then used misdirection and taijutsu..

    The whole story is,

    I was getting out of work at 60 hudson st in ny and went to the chambers st subway section, walked past the booth where a transit laday (the ones who sell the metro cards and tokens) was and slid my metro card and went through the turnstile and was about to go down the stairs when a guy who looked a little scruffy asked me for a dollar, I was feeling generous and pulled out 2 bucks and gave him the money, I put my wallet back in my pocket then started to walk away and the guy pulled out a knife and told me he wanted all my money, I turned around and well I did have some major money in the wallet and got really ****ed, but I didn't act ****ed. I pulled out my wallet and shook a little like I was scared.. and then dropped the wallet on the ground like it was an accident..he looked down at it and then I used my taijutsu..

    I stepped into him at the angle on his right side (my left), as he was holding the knife in his right hand, just as I was taught and grabbed his right wrist with my left and punched his hand holding the knife real hard with my right hand, and just like in training classes the knife went flying, then I pulled the guy foward to off balance him and he pulled back, so I then went into an omote gyaku and was amazed he went down and then I used the 1st kime waza roppo for omote gyaku to hold him there with his elbowed locked on my knee and screamed at him not to move as I used my body to cause him extreme pain and then advised him that I will kick him otherwise..the lady in the transit booth saw the whole thing and advised me that she saw it and that she was calling the cops, she called a transit cop and 5-10 mins later two cops came and arrested the guy and took my statement and the transit ladies statement and then I got home real late because I missed my train..

    note- I had to hold him locked up in the technique for what felt like an eternity before the cop came..

    now when I look back on this I was stupid, I should have just gave him the money, if he was skilled I could have lost my life but at the time I believed that I could take him, if it wasn't for me being comfortable with my skills in ninpo I definitely wouldn't have done it.

    now mind you I know my technique was not the best that night, what happened was fast and choppy but it saved me in this situation and it has made a lasting impression on me that ninpo/ninjutsu works when you need it..")
     

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