THE HIER TO THE HAPKIDO EMPIRE

Discussion in 'Korean Martial Arts Articles' started by XMAM, Mar 14, 2017.

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  1. Dr.Alireza

    Dr.Alireza Valued Member

    Thanks for both of your reply's Xmam. I asked it because in the case of the girl doing the splits you did not mention her parents being around and said she came to you and showed you the pictures.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2017
  2. XMAM

    XMAM Valued Member

    In the case of Marie she was alone with Chinil Chang and she waited for Chinil Chang to develop the pictures and once she had them. Then she didn't want to be around Chinil Chang. Yes she showed me the picture and explain how Chinil Chang got her to pose for them. after that the girl never return. Only she could have taken action and decided not to. From that moment on no other female ever joined Chinil Chang's school. It was like they knew he was bad news.
     
  3. aikiMac

    aikiMac boxing is fun Moderator Supporter

    But you knew all this, and stayed with Chang, because ... Oh, that's right, it's because you're an honorable father who wanted to teach his son "the way." Post 34. :rolleyes:
     
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  4. jaggernautico

    jaggernautico Valued Member

    I'm really baffled by the point of all of this. It seems your anger is aimed at the Wikipedia page and various other things because it seems to elevate someone who stripped you of your rank and thus you launched a tirade against your own teacher. The point being if he gave you the rank you probably don't deserve --you would have stayed silent about all this (which would have made you an even worse character than you already are). You don't have any credibility at this point --you said you should be a 3rd dan so are you saying as well that if you got the 3rd dan as per your demands--the techniques and teaching methods of Master Chang would have been superb and unquestionable since then you be the wonderful teacher of them? So once you were stripped of your rank--both master chang and the system he taught is suddenly horrible--despite you saying that you were there for 4 decades. Why 4 decades if the whole thing sucked? At this point, some of us are really questioning your sanity. What is the other side of this story? What is the story from the remaining students and master chang? I did not hear of master chang throwing out any other students so despite you hating or loving him you seem to be the only one in decades. I mean you put yourself in a horrible position because even if you attempted to teach--what would you be teaching? you certainly wouldn't be teaching hapkido since you trashed the teacher and method? Or will you buy yourself some rank from another organization which you should do and vanish into the sunset? I mean what is the end game here?
     
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  5. jaggernautico

    jaggernautico Valued Member

    Well here is where you are wrong--the black belt aug 1999 said that the interview was done NOT by mike wollemhauser or master chang but by the teacher Sheya and company in DC--so the rebuttal was to the fact that they removed master chang as the interviewer and mike as the videographer and they said they did the interview and made the tape THEMSELVES--Read the article and why the rebuttal. You don't understand what you are talking about. The rebuttal was a correction of why the tape was made and who did the interviewing. It is correcting that sheya and company had nothing to do with it.
     
  6. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    All your Hapkido are belong to us
     
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  7. Thomas

    Thomas Combat Hapkido/Taekwondo

    Along the topic of GM Chang Chin-il (Dojunim), I'd be more interested in seeing pictures of his Doju certificate and his 9th dan (and 10th dan certificate). Has anyone seen them (or photographed them)?
     
  8. XMAM

    XMAM Valued Member

    Well it look like your repeating your post for the second time, did you not say double post would be deleted. so what happen someone (personal attack removed).
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 8, 2017
  9. XMAM

    XMAM Valued Member

    Listen you must be hurting because I let the cat out of the bag. About the Email you sent and then you threaten thing would get worse and here you are crying. well go back and read Taekwondo times mar. 1989 pages 53, thru 56 and learn about the video recording. Then you go back to black belt Aug. 1999 and read that and at the end of the article you will see the vincent was the writer for Chinil Chang as always. also the other students would like to reflect on your threat that thing are going to get worst. they are detective, correction officers, police officers and even DEA ECT.... SO STOP CRYING
     
  10. XMAM

    XMAM Valued Member

     
  11. XMAM

    XMAM Valued Member

    Help my friend
    Well the certificates do exist. as his student I did see them. but Chinil Chang would never let any one take pictures of them.
     
  12. jaggernautico

    jaggernautico Valued Member

    nobody is threatening and nobody is crying...only YOU. You are obviously not reading things correctly or are terribly insecure or frightened. Letting the cat out of the bag--not only about master chang but YOURSELF. You are the one falling rapidly in credibility.

    Also you are evading reality here-you keep attacking and when approached with the reason or something that needs to be addressed--you fail to acknowledge it. Why is that?
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2017
  13. jaggernautico

    jaggernautico Valued Member

    So since this is a martial arts forum, and to pull off the lurid poorly written National Enquirer expose(as per your funny wording"letting the cat out of the bag"), the question here is DID you learn HAPKIDO for the last 4 decades that you were there in terms of physical technique and progression? And had you been given your desired belt you thought you deserved--would this curriculum been just fine to teach and propagate? Most importantly, if you were not receiving this sort of high level education then why did you stay and attempt to get a black belt? These are very simple questions that get to the heart of the matter.
     
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  14. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Mod note: Xmam- if you think the Terms of Service have been broken by double posting or anything else, the proper course of action is to report the post, not to complain about it in the thread. There is a report function in blue letters at the bottom of every post.

    Also, please refrain from personal attacks as that is definitely a TOS breach.

    Our Terms of Service can be found by clicking on the "Terms and Rules" button on the bottom right hand corner of every page.

    Thanks!
     
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  15. Dr.Alireza

    Dr.Alireza Valued Member

    Xmam I have another question You had said John and John and many others paid a lot of money to buy the belt levels in advance payments. My question is did these people receive a certificate of their belt level or were they with out certificates like the students that did not buy out their belts like your self and others who you said never got their certificates? also how come no one took him to court over payments?
     
  16. XMAM

    XMAM Valued Member

    First I like to say thanks for reading and understanding our memoirs. I would also like to say thanks to Thomas as both of you are achievers and have great knowledge. All your question are great. Which need to be answered I will do my best. Of cause there are references to search for on the WWW to get most answer for my post and then others that are not like the ones you ask.
    OK no one ever received certificate even when they paid extra, Student would stay because Chinil Chang would say certification were not required and every one was the rank assigned by him. So all trained together some would quit, leave and others stayed. Then the ones that left would return and train again with hopes that Chinil Chang could have changed his ways. this was not the case, Chinil Chang always required payments to be cash only with no payment documentations of paper trails ever. As far as going to the police or court well, here's way our student were police, correction officers, doctors, lawyers, soldiers, photagrifers, writers ect.. As stated through out in the heir to the hapkido empire chronicle all student bonded to gather to learn all that Chinil Chang could teach and we grew up together regardless and without certificates. Now of cause we were children who saw that parent would not take actions against Chinil Chinil so what could we have done as children but to except our teacher way. So we all contribute to the madness and mess for decades, As no one is perfect but Chinil Chang take the cake. All of us share this with you in the chronicle including Chinil Chang as he is well aware of the wrongs his committed as he grew up with as from 7th Dan to 10th Dan. he gave way for the chronicle to be written. So don't blame the messenger as this is the truth of Chinil Chang shared by not one but all of his students. Yes we all keep in contact with each other as we were all part of the trying time and we even speak of what is going on here and elsewhere. As there not here to write but they do read these post. Right; Richard, John, John, Marie, Nathan, Jason, Carlos, Mark and all the others love Xman. now for one short time student purple belt Vincent an exspirenced writer he took up the task to be Chinil Chang's advocate for damage control and wrote many a the false with half truth history of Chinil Chang on Wikipedia, Black Belt Magazine and etc. Vincent is innocent of not knowing the truth because since he was not around from 1970 and becoming a student at the end of 1985 and left in 1986 missing the truth again from 1986 through present day 2017. Not knowing He wrote anything Chinil Chang dictated thinking it is the true history of Chinil Chang. So when article come out written by Vincent you can be sure Chang is up to no good again my Master.
     
  17. jaggernautico

    jaggernautico Valued Member

    I would still like you to answer my question regarding the techniques and progression and the validity of those that was taught to the students since I think people were there training to learn something valid on top of a certificate since that to me is important because then it would isolate the problem to one aspect and not the totality of the learning experience. I want to know if you are saying the teaching and the learning cycle was bad as well?

    The Wiki is an open encyclopedia--so anyone can adjust and rewrite the entry or entries if they have the material proof and the references to site to make for the corrections or create new entries.

    Vincent has said in the past the book lost its publisher, just before a contract was finished due to the company/magazine going under, so it will not see the light of day since it was a long time ago. It was just a compendium of short chapters on different teachers and their lives, and circumstances like this, have changed over time and much would have to be rewritten or omitted so he doesn't believe it will ever come out at this point as he has other more pressing releases to tend to.
     
  18. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    I would like to chime in. The problem, especially before the internet, people went into a local martial art school and signed up. They took it upon faith that what they were studyiing did not have malice or was legit. They did not bother to research the art and/or instructor. Martial art history is shrouded with myth, hearsay, and even includes false documentation (of history and rank). People tend to stay with the art or instructor either out of denial, or a type of loyalty. And on some instances, something doesnt go theor way, leave, only to bash the style and/or instructor.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2017 at 1:28 PM
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  19. jaggernautico

    jaggernautico Valued Member

    Yes, but I don't think this completely applies to this situation. How trustworthy and accurate is the source here? He refuses any answer anything other than to bash and continue along one line. It is common knowledge now that he threatened to kill himself when the teacher threw him out of the class/system for various reasons. This is the rant obviously of a (certain) individual out for some sort of revenge--but he has defeated himself time and time again. He stood in the class and with the teacher for 3-4 decades for what reason? He was there to learn something and obviously that was good enough for him until it became about his own instability and rank. There is something way off about this attack and this individual.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2017 at 12:50 AM
  20. Dr.Alireza

    Dr.Alireza Valued Member

    I can understand Xmam saying that he stayed to gather information and write a bio on his master. But at the same time I don't understand why he would pay and spend his time for free fixing up the A/C, gym and everything else when he could have just said he just attend to do a bio and Chang would have been happy with it since Xmam says Vincent was writing for Chang. I just don't understand how anyone can train for 40 years an see others train and learn from a gym that he is teaching out of and all of them get nothing at the end and not even warn new comers to what is happening. 99% of people want some kind or receipt for what they pay for and every gym I have ever been a part of in Iran and Canada from Taekwondo, Karate, Kung Fu and free style wrestling never have I seen a gym that the students did not get a uniform, certificate, or signed a contract. It's also a miracle that no parent later on reported Change for child abuse or sexual abuse on a minor. specially when all of this happened in the States and in one of the most modern city's of the world New York. I'm not writing this post to attack any0ne or anything like that I just don't understand why someone would stay so long and how Change was able to operate for 40+ doing what Xmam says he did with out being arrested for running a pansy scam.
    I can't say if what Xmam is saying is truth or lie as I was not there.
     
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