Antony Cummins, author of Shinobi Soldiers et al - a discussion about his background

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by Manga, Jul 12, 2010.

  1. Manga

    Manga Moved On

    As the original thread is now becoming mired in ridiculous amounts of misdirection away from the original purpose, which was to investigate the background of Mr Antony Cummins and thus his eligibility to write and say the things he does in regard to the martial arts and indeed ninjutsu (in any sense), I thought it might be worthwhile gathering the factual data in one place rather than sifting through that giant thread to find points of discussion. That way it will be easier to examine the established facts.

    Let's keep this on topic as far as possible. Any attempts by Mr Cummins and his fanbase to redirect attention away from this very specific topic which has been stated clearly, should be ignored.

    I shall start us off with some links for reference.

    Antony Cummins' website.

    www.natori.co.uk

    Antony Cummins' interview with the Oldham Advertiser newspaper.

    http://menmedia.co.uk/oldhamadvertiser/news/s/1087183_anthony_is_one_of_the_warrior_race
     
  2. RhadeConstantin

    RhadeConstantin King of Badasses

    This is IMO a very good summation of the facts


     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2010
  3. Nutjob

    Nutjob Jimmy Tarbuck

    It's like leaving one party round here and moving in to the next with fresh beer and ladies!!!
     
  4. benkyoka

    benkyoka one million times

    My questions are about the background of the person translating the japanese to english for him. Such as:

    If she is a native Japanese speaker what is the highest english level test she has taken and passed?

    If she is a native english speaker what is the highest japanese level test she has taken and passed?

    What schooling does she have that qualifies her to be a translator?

    Does she know anything about the subject she is translating? (This is an important point, btw. My wife, who is herself a professional translator, often has to translate documents relating to subjects she knows nothing about, such as automobiles and patents and business documents. She will tell you that the translation work is difficult and she is unsure if the meaning is translated as intended due to her lack of knowledge on the subject.)


    And a thought for Mr. Cummins:

    People wishing to join the Katori Shinto Ryu have to take a blood oath stating that they won't reveal anything to people outside the ryuha. Did you take this blood oath and are you considered a student of the Katori Shinto Ryu? If you did take the oath are you going against it? If you didn't do you really expect Otake sensei to give you anything of any worth?
     
  5. Dale Seago

    Dale Seago Matthew 7:6

    I've seen that firsthand. My first time training in Japan was on a military mission in January of '87, and my commanding officer let me take off on my own the last couple of days to grab a shinkansen down from Sendai. We had a 20-year-old female half-Japanese ROTC cadet in my (Reserve) unit who was along and had been in the US since she was 16 (born & raised in Japan). With the most monumental insensitivity I have ever seen, my commander insisted on using her as a translator during briefings to our Japanese military counterparts.

    The poor lass was in agony the whole time. Not only was she stuck speaking the Japanese of an adolescent girl, she had no way to translate between American and Japanese military terminology. The icing on the cake was the female Japanese sergeant she bunked with complimenting her on how well she spoke Japanese for a foreigner. :bang:

    Not exactly an experience to cause her to think well of "masculine authority" as epitomized by the military.

    Whoa. . .sudden flash of illumination. I'm no psychologist, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if that was a factor in her going on to become a famous dominatrix after she got commissioned.
     
  6. Ace of Clubs

    Ace of Clubs Banned Banned

    :topic: You know this from first hand experience? :hat:

    So hard to stay on topic :eek:
     
  7. Dale Seago

    Dale Seago Matthew 7:6

    No, my experience was before she went that route, something I didn't know about until 4 or 5 years ago. :topic:
     
  8. JibranK

    JibranK Valued Member

    Did a certain Bujinkan instructor under discussion bring it up? ;)
     
  9. Dale Seago

    Dale Seago Matthew 7:6

    Nope.

    In fact, that was something I didn't know about the instructor in question until I saw it mentioned in a thread in the last few weeks. And I still don't know, or really care, whether it's actually that instructor's personal proclivity or not.

    Back on topic, please?
     
  10. RhadeConstantin

    RhadeConstantin King of Badasses

    I wonder if the people at the martial art school Antony runs. The Dignity of flapping dingbats or something like that, know about how much of Antony's "training" never really happened.:liar:
     
  11. Ace of Clubs

    Ace of Clubs Banned Banned

    I wonder how his students must feel about it. Imagine going to training one day and overhearing your peers talking about this forum on teh internets that claims your teacher is a big fat fraud... and then dawning on you that all that money and time you wasted with him was a big waste...

    Then being hit by the four stages of grief.


    Ahhh the sweet taste of denial is almost palpable.
     
  12. Arteanor

    Arteanor Valued Member

    glad to see that a topic has been made on his background, not sure what business it has being in the ninjutsu section... but it would seem that wasnt thought through...

    that said, have at it. a scan or even a flip through on video... maybe a scan of the ToC would do wonders to prove the whole " no reference section" bit.... without it, this is dangerously close to being libel...
     
  13. Arteanor

    Arteanor Valued Member

    i'm sure it is much akin to the way the people who have left the buj feel... actually, from what i have heard, it is EXACTLY the way the ex buj members feel.
     
  14. Nutjob

    Nutjob Jimmy Tarbuck

    Well seeing as h is targeting ninjutsu on the internet and with his book you would think thats self evident dont you think..duh...

    its TOS...plus Manga is only describing what is in the book so is free from libel...
     
  15. benkyoka

    benkyoka one million times

    really? I think there would be a huge amount of difference. One of the big ones involves language. I am guessing here, but it would seem Antony's 'students' speak the same language he does, whereas, most of Hatsumi's 'students' do not, cannot have a conversation with him, ergo, have no real relationship with him, and cannot look into whether his claims are true or not because they lack the language skills to do so, much like Antony himself.
     
  16. RhadeConstantin

    RhadeConstantin King of Badasses

    wow..you know...it may just be because he's written a book on ninjutsu?

    you're not exactly in a position to comment since you are not/were not part of the bujinkan and have no experience in martial arts so your criticism does not have any value. That being said please look at the OP again.

    also

    this is the definition of libel.

    A false publication, as in writing, print, signs, or pictures, that damages a person's reputation.
    The act of presenting such material to the public.


    If you feel the images provided by Manga, the list of amatsu practitioners provided and all the other information provided is false, then I'm sure you can prove it quite easily. otherwise the only one guilty of libel, is you for falsely claiming that the people on MAP lied. next time you post please include some evidence and not carry on with your monotonous accusations of libel and bias.Also Keep in mind that Antony Cummin's was unable to refute whatever was said here and infact ran when confronted with these facts.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2010
  17. Manga

    Manga Moved On

    Oooh! Fun fun happy fun! Swinging round terms like libel in an attempt to silence critics!

    For a start my little cupcake (yes, I said it), it's not libel if it's true. There is nothing I have said which hasn't been backed up by solid evidence e.g. screen shots and scans. Don't want to take my word for it? That's reasonable. Go and buy copies of Shinobi Soldiers and Hattori Hanzo and you'll see for yourself :cool: Also buy a copy of Secret Weapons of Jujutsu by Don Cunningham. That way you'll be able to see for yourself that my assertations of plagiarism are reasonable. Antony Cummins was invited to comment and he chose instead to bluff and bluster and get abusive (threatening dojo yaburi on one person and calling people various names in You Tube posts.)

    You yourself have said you wouldn't support his work if it turned out there was no reference section. Well I've proven there isn't. So remind me why you're still defending him?

    Oh that's right, I remember now. Because you're Antony Cummins :hat:
     
  18. skuggvarg

    skuggvarg Valued Member

    Manga, did you see that as a threat? I saw it as a great opportunity..
    Just think about the possibility to have it video taped and put on Youtube and Facebook. Sweeet..:hat: Seriously though. Is there nothing more important to discuss around here?

    Regards / Skuggvarg
     
  19. Frodocious

    Frodocious She who MUST be obeyed! Moderator Supporter

    As others have said, it's not libel if the information being given is true. If Mr Cummins wants to publish a book about Ninjutsu then he has to accept criticism from those who know about the subject, particularly if what he's writing is incorrect or giving a false impression of the style. If he doesn't want to face criticism, then he shouldn't be writing a book for public consumption!
     
  20. Manga

    Manga Moved On

    Skuggvarg said - "Manga, did you see that as a threat? I saw it as a great opportunity.."

    Well it wasn't against me of course but from what I've been told, more than a few people were offering to be visiting Andy's class by sheer coincidence if anything was arranged ;)

    "Seriously though. Is there nothing more important to discuss around here?"

    Absolutely! That's why we have the capability to have multiple threads at once, discussing multiple subjects at once. Feel free to start a new thread about something you feel is more important than busting frauds.
     

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